Vios Cv Joints Constantly Breaking! :(

virensti · June 23, 2009

Well reffering to my earlier problem with the engine rev up issue, (thanks to everyone who helped me out on that) its gonna get sorted at the end of the month, (Apparently has some blocked injectors, so the petrol sometimes goes to the piston even after the throttle valve is closed, and has a stuck VVT-I system, but Bruce Nigel's gonna sort me out on that one )

ANYWAYS back to the bloody CV joints!! We are on the 5th CV joint now!! both the left and right one are making the "katakata" noise now which means they're obviously gone! The boots are fine as well!! Does anyone have any idea's as to why this is happening? All the CV joints have been bought from GS auto in Rajagiriya, you think the stuff there are bad? Case I'm quite frankly getting sick of these damn CV joints!!! (5 thousand bucks per CV joint doesnt help either!!) Does anyone have any ideas as to why these might be constantly breaking? Something wrong with the suspension maybe?? And I cant afford the stuff from Toyota cause they sell the entire set (axels and the CV joints together) and that's something like 45 thousand or something!

so once again...

help!!! :unsure:

virensti · June 25, 2009

Hi mate...Its sad to hear the situ.
Normally the boot cracks / tears leads to CVJ failures or fair wear and tear .But your case is different since you replaced them very short period of time and boots were good.

Did you feel clunks during acceleration?

Did you replace the CVJ only? How about the condition of axel?

Did you use the same make CVJ and the same mechanic for the job?

Inproper torque on the strut bolts lead to pre-mature failures., abuse of the hammer on the axle nut ruins many. In a case of reuseing the axle it is always recommended to use a puller when needed and only few gentle hammer taps.This many average mechanics not aware.These damages cannot be judged by the naked eye sometimes.

Change the CVJ make and the place used for the job next time.

Take your car to a qualified mechanic/engineer.

If need to know where I replace my CVJs (with total trust)..just PM me.I've Done it more than dozen times,never repeated in one vehicle.

Good Luck!

MINIACE

Thanks Miniace, I pm'd you, so lemmie know the details kz. And yeah the mechanics did try and break the old cv's by smashing them with a hammer, guess the axel wouldn't have liked it, and whats more due to wheels spins and hard launches etc(very rarely though), i'm guessing the axels are under a massive load and probably have warped or twisted slightly.. I dunno though

HardHat · June 25, 2009

ANYWAYS back to the bloody CV joints!! We are on the 5th CV joint now!! both the left and right one are making the "katakata" noise now which means they're obviously gone! The boots are fine as well!! Does anyone have any idea's as to why this is happening?

I'm still puzzled as to what could be causing this

which of the joints broke? wheel end, diff end or all four? did any of the joints physically come apart?

you said that you replaced the joints but kept the same axels - did you replace all four joints each time?

virensti · June 25, 2009

I'm still puzzled as to what could be causing this
which of the joints broke? wheel end, diff end or all four? did any of the joints physically come apart?

you said that you replaced the joints but kept the same axels - did you replace all four joints each time?

I'm sorry man I made a mistake, 3 CVJ's have been replaced not 5. sorry (it'll be 5 soon since the current 2 are gone as well). But that's still alot and only the wheel end joints were replaced, No they didnt physically come apart, but we didnt wanna wait till then cause in case of an emergancy if they broke then we'd be stuck. Same axels, we only changed the wheel end CVJ's. I wanted to change both the axels and the CVJ's from Toyota, but they said it would come to 40 thousand odd (this was sometime last year) so it was alot cheaper to just buy the CVJ's for 5thou and use them thinking nothing would happen.. I'm trying to search for a different brand of CVJ's than the ones we've used so far..

miniace · June 25, 2009

Thanks Miniace, I pm'd you,

Reply sent mate!

MINIACE

NPP · June 26, 2009

probably one or both of your rear shocks bottoming out dude, but to narrow down the cause, does the thud come when the car is falling into the pot hole or when it is climbing out of it?

i guess it's while falling into a hole...

Check the rear suspension arm bushes. I had the same problem a few week back & had to replace the bushes. It costs about 2200 per bush at Toyota Lanka.

it could be that your rear shocks are gone too, when ours were gone, there was a big thud everytime we went over pot holes, I think its cause all the gas has gone from the shock, so it cant exactly absorb any shock. But I might be completely wrong. hehe

To tell you NPP, i am also getting the same problem in my vios. Its just comming once in a while, from rear wheel right side. During my last service, we checked the shocks, nothing wrong with them.

the car went for a service after the sound started appearing, but they did not find anything wrong!

VVTi · June 26, 2009

Machang, long shot here. Have you checked your Engine Mounts? When they about to fail or failing, all sorts of funny sounds that you might associate with everything BUT the obvious.

Check the wheel hub bearings as well.

(Talking through a really educational and expensive experience here)

For CV J normal brand that works for the price and road conditions are HDK.

virensti · June 29, 2009

For CV J normal brand that works for the price and road conditions are HDK.

Machan I think the CV J's we've been using all this time are HDK. :unsure: So I guess there must be something radically wrong with my car setup.. =(

VVTi · June 29, 2009

Machan I think the CV J's we've been using all this time are HDK. So I guess there must be something radically wrong with my car setup.. =(

Your problem is truly mind boggling...

Rack ends?

Ball joints?

Lower Arms?

Shock mounts?

All ok?

I mean, there is NO WAY, even a crappy set of CVJs can go bad so Soon.... Unless you packed it with sand before you installed them... did you?

HardHat · June 29, 2009

Machang, long shot here. Have you checked your Engine Mounts? When they about to fail or failing, all sorts of funny sounds that you might associate with everything BUT the obvious.

Hmm... come to think of it, that could be a posssibility?

failing engine mounts --> engine and gear box going kind of 'out of place' under load --> undue stress on the CV joints and axels??

might be a long shot but worth checking I guess

HardHat · June 29, 2009

question - for the sake of those of us who are not so familiar with these stuff:

in a rear wheel drive car you've got two universal joints at either end of prop shaft and a "sliding joint" (what's the correct technical term?) to compensate the fluctuation of prop shaft length due to suspension travel

in a FWD, of course all four CV joints act as universal joints but where is the sliding joint?

virensti · June 29, 2009

Your problem is truly mind boggling...
Rack ends?

Ball joints?

Lower Arms?

Shock mounts?

All ok?

I mean, there is NO WAY, even a crappy set of CVJs can go bad so Soon.... Unless you packed it with sand before you installed them... did you?

I think all those are fine.. Lower arms I'm not too sure.. but the suspension seems ok.. =S As you say it really is mind boggling.... lol NO I didnt!! hehe, I'm wondering if the axel grease we get with the CV J is bad? (doubt that very much though) guess my only option is to save up cash and buy the entire set from Toyota..

virensti · June 29, 2009

question - for the sake of those of us who are not so familiar with these stuff:
in a rear wheel drive car you've got two universal joints at either end of prop shaft and a "sliding joint" (what's the correct technical term?) to compensate the fluctuation of prop shaft length due to suspension travel

in a FWD, of course all four CV joints act as universal joints but where is the sliding joint?

well it's like this, you get the constant velocity joints (CV joints. aka homo kinetic joints) these transmit the rotary motion uniformly.

There are also sliding CV joints (aka tripod joints i think) these can be used in the case of independent suspension on fwd and rwd.

you also get the pot joints which are ball joints which are guided by a cage and run on straight tracks of the ball star and the ball shells, these also provide diffraction angles as well as axial displacement.. (in english it can rotate in any direction and slide)

I'm not sure which cars have sliding CV J's at the wheel and sliding cv joints at the diff. But this what I know. I could very well be wrong though.

HardHat · June 30, 2009

(CV joints. aka homo kinetic joints)

now this is getting X rated

virensti you seem to have done a fair bit of homework on this, if not your line of studies / work already deals with this kind of stuff. Thanks for shairing the info

I'm trying to figure out whether a local mechanic could be doing something wrong when assembling a set of CV joints to an axel, which could restrict certain movements of the unit. If so, this could subject the joints to undue stress and eventual failure.

virensti · June 30, 2009

now this is getting X rated
virensti you seem to have done a fair bit of homework on this, if not your line of studies / work already deals with this kind of stuff. Thanks for shairing the info

I'm trying to figure out whether a local mechanic could be doing something wrong when assembling a set of CV joints to an axel, which could restrict certain movements of the unit. If so, this could subject the joints to undue stress and eventual failure.

You're welcome. Yup this is my line of studies well techinically this is the start, my main line is automotive engineering in motorsports.

Anyways, I think there could be loads of wrong ways a mechanic can be doing when assembling a cv joint, I mean they tried soo many times to break our previous cv's off the axel by hammering it with a hammer. It didnt work and then only they got it cut. I think my last option regarding my problem is to buy the entire set from Toyota, (which comes with the axels and everything) and then pray that NOTHING goes wrong for the remaining years in this car's life. hehe. But saving up the cash is gonna take at least 3 months.. And I hope these currents ones we have (which are gone) will last till then.. if not, its astala vista cv jointa! lol

roadhog · June 30, 2009

Where did you get the CV joints changed i.e. the garage is it a known/ reputed place?.

Or did they simply fill the old CV joint with grease so the noise goes away for a while ??. and you thought the new one is fitted. :alc:

virensti · June 30, 2009

Where did you get the CV joints changed i.e. the garage is it a known/ reputed place?.
Or did they simply fill the old CV joint with grease so the noise goes away for a while ??. and you thought the new one is fitted.

I got it done at "Risilko engineering" on the road from palawatta to baththaramulla (before la passion if your coming from palawatta side) and no they put the new ones lol.. I watched them do everything hehe..

HardHat · June 30, 2009

perhaps your axels are bent (now that we know the mechanics raped the axels trying to dislodge the joints), or they've stuffed grease into joints unevenly

both the above scenarios can effect uneven centrifugal forces when these are rotating at high speed, which could lead to failure??

Edited June 30, 2009 by HardHat

NPP · June 30, 2009

i sent u a PM

:rolleyes:

virensti · June 30, 2009

perhaps your axels are bent (now that we know the mechanics raped the axels trying to dislodge the joints), or they've stuffed grease into joints unevenly
both the above scenarios can effect uneven centrifugal forces when these are rotating at high speed, which could lead to failure??

I know, it is quite possible. Right now that seems to be the only reason that makes sense.. Cause I watched them add the CVJ grease and it was applied very evenly, It cant be cause of that..

seeker · July 1, 2009

Hahahaa! i was thinking the same thing and was wondering where Nilantha was.....
<<Theme song for sumerman starts playing softly>>

Look! its a bird! its a plane! NO its Nilantha in a Corolla!

oh no, its just a regular corolla...

Perhaps it's not a Toyota... may be Nissan is selling stuff under Vios badge, just to discredit the Unbreakables..

virensti · July 3, 2009

Okay guys I just got back from Panchigawatta. Now Toyota parts are just OUT of the question!! It's soo expensive its Ridiculous! for 1 SIDE Axel with CV joint is 75 THOUSAND RUPEES! (yes 75) and for the other side axel with CVJ is 56 THOUSAND! so thats 131,000 Rs!! Bloody insane! So forget Toyota! I checked around, and found some shops which sell CVJ's. (btw the CVJ's we've put so far are HDK! )

Now one shop said they'll gimmie the HDK at 5500 bucks with a "1 year warrenty" (I highly doubt it but he insisted saying it's gonna be on the bill and blah blah) Now G.S Auto said they dont get HDK any more due to a lot of complaints, and they now have NTN or something :S that's 4600 with no warrenty rubbish. So which ones should I go for people? Niether me nor my dad are looking forward to buying yet another set of HDK's. Lemmie know.!

btw i'm still fuming over the Toyota prices!!!

harshansenadhir · July 3, 2009

Okay guys I just got back from Panchigawatta. Now Toyota parts are just OUT of the question!! It's soo expensive its Ridiculous! for 1 SIDE Axel with CV joint is 75 THOUSAND RUPEES! (yes 75) and for the other side axel with CVJ is 56 THOUSAND! so thats 131,000 Rs!! Bloody insane! So forget Toyota! I checked around, and found some shops which sell CVJ's. (btw the CVJ's we've put so far are HDK! )
Now one shop said they'll gimmie the HDK at 5500 bucks with a "1 year warrenty" (I highly doubt it but he insisted saying it's gonna be on the bill and blah blah) Now G.S Auto said they dont get HDK any more due to a lot of complaints, and they now have NTN or something :S that's 4600 with no warrenty rubbish. So which ones should I go for people? Niether me nor my dad are looking forward to buying yet another set of HDK's. Lemmie know.!

btw i'm still fuming over the Toyota prices!!!

I'm not quite sure the brands when it comes to Panchikawatta business, coz brands can be anything but the actual stuff may be darn cheap metal junk. My strategy in buying from panchikawatta is get the thing at lowest, yes the least price to even if it breaks quite often I'm better off. Don't get me wrong i'm not encouraging cheap spares but if you're to go for cheap, go for cheapest as there won't be much difference.

For the Lancer, I did a CV replace and brake repair (yes I did it to gauge how much does it costs). Bought IZUMI CV joints each at 2250 and after 8 months of abusive drive including my brothers adopting driving patterns they just doing fine. I hope I can now write off the price I paid for CVs and 900 bucks I paid for the brake pads.

virensti · July 4, 2009

I'm not quite sure the brands when it comes to Panchikawatta business, coz brands can be anything but the actual stuff may be darn cheap metal junk. My strategy in buying from panchikawatta is get the thing at lowest, yes the least price to even if it breaks quite often I'm better off. Don't get me wrong i'm not encouraging cheap spares but if you're to go for cheap, go for cheapest as there won't be much difference.
For the Lancer, I did a CV replace and brake repair (yes I did it to gauge how much does it costs). Bought IZUMI CV joints each at 2250 and after 8 months of abusive drive including my brothers adopting driving patterns they just doing fine. I hope I can now write off the price I paid for CVs and 900 bucks I paid for the brake pads.

wow 2500 for cv's.. damn! and 900 for brakes??? are you talking about the pads or the oil? lol that's insanely cheap man! We're gonna by brakes in a couple of weeks time for 12 thousand! (front and rear pads) :mellow:

harshansenadhir · July 6, 2009

wow 2500 for cv's.. damn! and 900 for brakes??? are you talking about the pads or the oil? lol that's insanely cheap man! We're gonna by brakes in a couple of weeks time for 12 thousand! (front and rear pads)

i agree and that was the first major repair i did on the lancer and i was amazed too coz i used to the prices of 406 where a cv cost at least 14k and front pad set at around 5k. Back to lancer, yes one cv at 2250 and front pad set at 900. Paid 800 for the lathe shop for phasing disks plus my time for removal / fixing. I understood why jap cars holds a good market in sl in the hard way

virensti · July 6, 2009

i agree and that was the first major repair i did on the lancer and i was amazed too coz i used to the prices of 406 where a cv cost at least 14k and front pad set at around 5k. Back to lancer, yes one cv at 2250 and front pad set at 900. Paid 800 for the lathe shop for phasing disks plus my time for removal / fixing. I understood why jap cars holds a good market in sl in the hard way

Well my dad isn't gonna buy brake pads for 900 bucks! lol He just said no way! hehe but the CVJ's.. What's the brand you put machan?