Radiator Coolent & Transmission Oil

[Edward]

Hi Guys,

When Using the radiator coolent some says we should not mix water with the coolent & some says we should. Also advice if we are to mix water, is there any brand of coolent available in market.

When changing the auto gear oil, what is the best way to do it. Do we need suck out all the old oil & completely replace, which is a very expensive process. My mechanin says it is not necessary to change the whole oil, but can take out the oil by removing the sump, clean it & replace with 4 gallons of oil.

[VVTi]

Hi Guys,

When Using the radiator coolent some says we should not mix water with the coolent & some says we should. Also advice if we are to mix water, is there any brand of coolent available in market.

When changing the auto gear oil, what is the best way to do it. Do we need suck out all the old oil & completely replace, which is a very expensive process. My mechanin says it is not necessary to change the whole oil, but can take out the oil by removing the sump, clean it & replace with 4 gallons of oil.

4 gallons of oil?????? I think you should first of replace your mechanic!!!

Depending on the vehicle it should be 50:50 mixture of coolant and water.

As for the AT Fluid change, its a mixed bag. Some people do the manual thing, some people prefer the machine.... But the machine cleaning is less invasive and seem to work well. Mechanics loves to complicate simple stuff to make extra money off gullible vehicle users.

[Rebel]

Depending on the vehicle it should be 50:50 mixture of coolant and water.

Depends on the type of coolant too

[VVTi]

Depends on the type of coolant too

Yes.. some you get pre-mixed and some you have to mix at the time of filling.

[xXx]

Mechanics loves to complicate simple stuff to make extra money off gullible vehicle users.

you got a point there. but don't you think the places that got the fancy gadgetry charge more because they got fancy stuff than the 'maka bass' down the road???

[maikk99]

HI

I can give u some feed back on the ATF changing.

when u use the machine what these guys do is to use another 3-4 litres of ATF to " clean " the system but it actually do not clean the filters inside the sump

so even if u do machine based ATF it is good to get the sump cleaned so there wont be any left out that can harm the internal systems

since we change ATF in about 25000km (or 30000km) you can still do the manuala clean way which will give you clean system as well as the ATF change

as per Toyota what agents does is the manual way so i guess manual method is more suitable

/rgds

mike

[virensti]

Depends on the type of coolant too

I'm looking deeply into the coolant business as I need to replace the coolant in my car. It came with the "Toyota long life coolant" in it. its the red colour one. Now from what I've been told, red is the- Anti freeze. i.e quite pointless for sri lanka, cause not even in Nuwaraeliya do liquids freeze. So I'm looking to change to Wurth green colour coolant. my car (vios) takes about 4.1 Litres of coolant and water. So I'm gonna need 2 litres of wurth and 2 litres of water.

Can any of the experts tell me if its okay doing this? cause some people have told me to stick to the red colour anti freeze(Cause it came with the car), and others have said to change to the green. oh and btw, is a Radiator flushing required? (as in is it mandatory?) and if yes, whats the flushing liquids you guys use? thanks everyone. sorry if I went OT.

Edited August 31, 2009 by virensti

[VVTi]

I'm looking deeply into the coolant business as I need to replace the coolant in my car. It came with the "Toyota long life coolant" in it. its the red colour one. Now from what I've been told, red is the- Anti freeze. i.e quite pointless for sri lanka, cause not even in Nuwaraeliya do liquids freeze. So I'm looking to change to Wurth green colour coolant. my car (vios) takes about 4.1 Litres of coolant and water. So I'm gonna need 2 litres of wurth and 2 litres of water.

Can any of the experts tell me if its okay doing this? cause some people have told me to stick to the red colour anti freeze(Cause it came with the car), and others have said to change to the green. oh and btw, is a Radiator flushing required? (as in is it mandatory?) and if yes, whats the flushing liquids you guys use? thanks everyone. sorry if I went OT.

If there is nothing wrong with it, leave it as it is. Even the brand new Corollas that are sold by Toyota has the same stuff. If it ain't broke, don't try fixin'!

If there is no leak, if the fluid is not discoloured, if your vehicle is not overheating, why change?

[VVTi]

you got a point there. but don't you think the places that got the fancy gadgetry charge more because they got fancy stuff than the 'maka bass' down the road???

True, but then, will the Maka baas, know how to remove a sump of a AT without messing up the gaskets? I know a friend who went against all advice and let a maka baas remove the sump and clean... maka baas tightened one sump bolt a bit too much and broke it.... he saved money alright!!

No point in being penny wise but pound foolish....

and for general info... Toyota mechanics in Sri Lanka knows less than a maka baas.... ask Ripper.... he will tell you with a few expletives.

[virensti]

If there is nothing wrong with it, leave it as it is. Even the brand new Corollas that are sold by Toyota has the same stuff. If it ain't broke, don't try fixin'!

If there is no leak, if the fluid is not discoloured, if your vehicle is not overheating, why change?

no mate, changing cause, during some repairs recently we had to take apart the hosing to the raditor cap and all, so alot of the coolent spilled, so there's very low % of coolant and alot of water. So I dont wanna risk not changing it and letting the engine rust up. the car has done 95k on the clock as well, so thats why I'm changing.

[Ruslan]

no mate, changing cause, during some repairs recently we had to take apart the hosing to the raditor cap and all, so alot of the coolent spilled, so there's very low % of coolant and alot of water. So I dont wanna risk not changing it and letting the engine rust up. the car has done 95k on the clock as well, so thats why I'm changing.

There are two types of Toyota Coolant. pre mixed (50-50) slightly pink coolant. and concentrated red coolant. i replaced radiator coolant in my car couple of months a go. herd somewhere that it's bad for the Gaskets and water pump if you mix with certain coolant types. (Non silicate coolant with Silicate based coolant) so got the Toyota red coolant and mix it (50-50) with Distilled water. i use Toyota red long life thing (i think that's a silicate free coolant, which already came with the car)

[CARBON]

I'm looking deeply into the coolant business as I need to replace the coolant in my car. It came with the "Toyota long life coolant" in it. its the red colour one. Now from what I've been told, red is the- Anti freeze. i.e quite pointless for sri lanka, cause not even in Nuwaraeliya do liquids freeze. So I'm looking to change to Wurth green colour coolant. my car (vios) takes about 4.1 Litres of coolant and water. So I'm gonna need 2 litres of wurth and 2 litres of water.

Can any of the experts tell me if its okay doing this? cause some people have told me to stick to the red colour anti freeze(Cause it came with the car), and others have said to change to the green. oh and btw, is a Radiator flushing required? (as in is it mandatory?) and if yes, whats the flushing liquids you guys use? thanks everyone. sorry if I went OT.

I had the same problem too much of water to coolant and some rust particles, so got the system flushed and refiled with the green stuff.

There was a remarkable difference as now it take much longer for the temp to come to normal level. But I have heard that having too much coolant than water can also create some problems. Not sure what these are ?

[MkX]

no mate, changing cause, during some repairs recently we had to take apart the hosing to the raditor cap and all, so alot of the coolent spilled, so there's very low % of coolant and alot of water. So I dont wanna risk not changing it and letting the engine rust up. the car has done 95k on the clock as well, so thats why I'm changing.

emm same here. My EK3 got green colour coolant. But ration is around 20% - 80% (Clnt : Wtr). Any recommend brand for Honda?

[GihanFX]

so got the Toyota red coolant and mix it (50-50) with Distilled water. i use Toyota red long life thing (i think that's a silicate free coolant, which already came with the car)

This is the most important point, most mix normal water with the coolant or they just put normal water in to the radiator, but its always recommended to you Distilled water, also when mixing coolant 50-50 is the best, but for copper Radiators 70% water and 30% coolant is better

[virensti]

I had the same problem too much of water to coolant and some rust particles, so got the system flushed and refiled with the green stuff.

There was a remarkable difference as now it take much longer for the temp to come to normal level. But I have heard that having too much coolant than water can also create some problems. Not sure what these are ?

mate how'd you flush the system? as in whats the flushing liquid you used? and was the previous coolant you had also green? let me know please. thanks.

and i think that having too much coolant affects the cooling itself, cause coolant is there to prevent rust, and the water is what keeps the temp down? not sure though

[virensti]

This is the most important point, most mix normal water with the coolant or they just put normal water in to the radiator, but its always recommended to you Distilled water, also when mixing coolant 50-50 is the best, but for copper Radiators 70% water and 30% coolant is better

mate isn't that battery water? I didn't know you had to put distilled water.. I've always used mineral water. this is to prevent the rust factor right?

[Edward]

4 gallons of oil?????? I think you should first of replace your mechanic!!!

Depending on the vehicle it should be 50:50 mixture of coolant and water.

As for the AT Fluid change, its a mixed bag. Some people do the manual thing, some people prefer the machine.... But the machine cleaning is less invasive and seem to work well. Mechanics loves to complicate simple stuff to make extra money off gullible vehicle users.

Hi Friends,

Sorry it is 4 liters not 4 gallons. I am still not clear wheather to go for manuel or machine change. Is there any one who has alredy done a manuel change, & had problems with it. ( of course after cleanining the sump)

Toyota agent in my area gave me two litres of coolent & asked me to mix with water in the radiater. Is this ok? How much water the normal ratiater contains in a AE 110.

Regds

[VVTi]

Hi Friends,

Sorry it is 4 liters not 4 gallons. I am still not clear wheather to go for manuel or machine change. Is there any one who has alredy done a manuel change, & had problems with it. ( of course after cleanining the sump)

Toyota agent in my area gave me two litres of coolent & asked me to mix with water in the radiater. Is this ok? How much water the normal ratiater contains in a AE 110.

Regds

No one I know has done a manual change, though everyone talks of it. A manual change wont get rid of the oil that is still inside the torque converter, (upto a litre) where as the machine will pull it all out and replace.

If you live in or around Colombo, why don't you take it to a reputed Service centre and get both things done machang. Saves you this headache of wondering about it. I got my car's coolant flushed at PTStoP for 5000 bucks and no complaints. They do a proper job. Even AtuMiraj does the same kind of work. Take the guessing out of the equation and just do it.

[Elvis_Pil]

Just take it to the Agents and get the job done... The AE110 should be non cvt and will be straight forward job. - Actually even laughs will be able to do the job without much hassle. Really not much to worry about if there are no issues with gear box.

5k for coolant flush? what brand did they use?

[Corolla121]

True, but then, will the Maka baas, know how to remove a sump of a AT without messing up the gaskets? I know a friend who went against all advice and let a maka baas remove the sump and clean... maka baas tightened one sump bolt a bit too much and broke it.... he saved money alright!!

No point in being penny wise but pound foolish....

and for general info... Toyota mechanics in Sri Lanka knows less than a maka baas.... ask Ripper.... he will tell you with a few expletives.

you may be correct on toyota maka bass thing. but changing ATF manually is nothing to do with toyota maka bass. it should be a compnay policy. Just my idea.

[Corolla121]

I'm looking deeply into the coolant business as I need to replace the coolant in my car. It came with the "Toyota long life coolant" in it. its the red colour one. Now from what I've been told, red is the- Anti freeze. i.e quite pointless for sri lanka, cause not even in Nuwaraeliya do liquids freeze. So I'm looking to change to Wurth green colour coolant. my car (vios) takes about 4.1 Litres of coolant and water. So I'm gonna need 2 litres of wurth and 2 litres of water.

Can any of the experts tell me if its okay doing this? cause some people have told me to stick to the red colour anti freeze(Cause it came with the car), and others have said to change to the green. oh and btw, is a Radiator flushing required? (as in is it mandatory?) and if yes, whats the flushing liquids you guys use? thanks everyone. sorry if I went OT.

I dont know abut coolent colour. but my 2005 brandnew 121 came with green colour coolent and it says to replace it after 110,000Km's. You can buy the same thing from toyota lanka. diluting instructions given on the cover.

[Ruslan]

No one I know has done a manual change, though everyone talks of it. A manual change wont get rid of the oil that is still inside the torque converter, (upto a litre) where as the machine will pull it all out and replace.

If you live in or around Colombo, why don't you take it to a reputed Service centre and get both things done machang. Saves you this headache of wondering about it. I got my car's coolant flushed at PTStoP for 5000 bucks and no complaints. They do a proper job. Even AtuMiraj does the same kind of work. Take the guessing out of the equation and just do it.

true that manual method does not remove most of ATF (including oil inside torque converter) but most of the techs that i talk to me strongly advised against using a flushing machine to remove ATF. They said that it could damage (most machines use pressurized system to remove oil) torque converter and certain valves. And using a machine in high mileage auto box could cause serious trouble it seems. maybe thats why most of the agents not using this technique to remove oil.

[GihanFX]

mate isn't that battery water? I didn't know you had to put distilled water.. I've always used mineral water. this is to prevent the rust factor right?

Subaru Coolant System FAQ

What type of coolant should I run in my car? You can never go wrong by using Genuine Subaru Coolant available through your local dealer.

Is the Subaru coolant pre-mixed or not? They have both kinds, but BE SURE to read the labels carefully as they are nearly identical in appearance except the wording on the package!

What aftermarket coolant can I use? This Subaru .pdf document states Subaru's position on which type of aftermarket coolant you can safely use.

Is there a required coolant additive? Yes. Subaru Cooling System Conditioner has recently been required to be added with every coolant replacement to prevent coolant system leaks. This recommendation applies to every Subaru model for every model year.

What is the best coolant? The "best" coolant differs from stock SOA advice, so use at your own discretion. Ensure you choose one that contains no silicates and no phosphates. Silicates act as a cleaner, but also eat away at water pumps and seals. If you mix a coolant containing phosphates and water with a high mineral content, the phosphates in the coolant may “drop out” and form deposits in your cooling system that can lead to corrosion. Only recently have aftermarket coolant manufacturers started producing silicate and phosphate free coolant. Generally speaking, the types of coolant that are compliant are the newer "extended life" coolants. However, you should carefully review the product labels and/or product websites to ensure they are silicate/phosphate free.

What is the best coolant ver 2.0? As far as the best coolant for removing heat from your engine, it would be 100% water. You might even see better heat removal capability if there is a coolant additive mixed with it. Obviously, 100% water should be used in racing only applications and only by advanced users. Its use in a normal passenger car is NOT recommended even for short use. Water has a very high heat capacity. The reason it is mixed with ethylene or propylene glycol is to lower the freezing point below 32F and raise the boiling point above 212F. Both water and ethylene or propylene glycol are essential to the coolant's function.

Can I use the new blue colored Subaru Super Coolant in my pre 2008 Subaru? My edited for clarity response from SOA when I asked this question on 5/29/2008 is below.

We can only recommend that you use the coolant that is recommended for your pre 2008 Subaru. This is because we have not tested or researched using the Super Coolant in previous year models.

Best wishes,

Nancy Quinn

Subaru of America, Inc.

Customer/Dealer Services Department

What types of coolants are available? Ethylene glycol (EG) and propylene glycol (PG). PG is a newer coolant and can either be marketed as one of the new "long life" coolants or "environmentally friendly" coolants. Performance characteristics between the two types are fairly close, so either would be fine for use. PG coolants could be considered to have a "slight edge" based on comparative data though.

What about coolant enhancers? Coolant enhancers are made by several different companies and have several different uses. The main use is to provide increase surfactant action of the water/coolant mix. Surfactants allow a better contact between the coolant and the engine wall surface, which aids in the heat exchange process. Enhancers are fairly inexpensive, and may bring down the temperature a few degrees. These products tend to overstate their claims though. Actual temperature reductions are significantly less when used with coolants. They often advertise "minus XX degrees" on their packaging, when in fact these figures come from using straight water instead of coolant. When used with coolant, temperature reduction of enhancers is greatly reduced. Popular manufacturers include:

Neo Synthetics' Keep Cool

Royal Purple's Purple Ice

hy-per lube's Super Coolant

Red Line Oil's Water Wetter

Should I use tap water, deionized water, or distilled water when mixing? Best waters to use are in this order:

1. Deionized water

2. Distilled water

3. Tap water

Never use straight deionized water in a cooling system, as it by itself, it is VERY corrosive and caustic.

Are there any advanced coolants? Evans and Engine Ice could be considered advanced. These should only be used after considerable research on the pros and cons of each fluid.

What about the freezing point of my coolant and the proper mix ratio? With a 50/50 ratio (Subaru recommended) of coolant to water -37 C / -35 F is the freezing point. Different coolants using different ratios will result in different freeze protection levels. Check the coolant product label for specific information as each coolant manufacturer utilizes additives that can affect freeze temperatures. If you live in an area where temperatures may go below these values, check with your Subaru service center for their recommendations on coolant dilution ratios.

What about coolant colors? Currently, there is no color standard. This means that if you have green coolant in your radiator, you should not necessarily buy green coolant to top off your radiator. In this situation, you can do two things if you do not know the specific coolant type:

1. Use a multi-compatible coolant. Some manufacturers have coolants that will work with many varieties of coolants. These products should also be silicate and phosphate free. Carefully read the manufacturer's label for these details prior to purchasing.

2. Perform an engine flush and replace with new coolant. Note coolant manufacturer and type for future reference.

Are there compatibility issues with coolants? Yes. Some coolants are not designed to be used with other types. Ensure you read the product label for compatibility.

What about higher pressure radiator caps? Higher pressure radiator caps increase the boiling point of your coolant. Higher pressure = higher boiling point. Higher coolant pressures also transfer heat from the cylinder heads more efficiently. There have been several reported cases of higher pressure radiator caps causing ruptures in the endtanks on any OEM Subaru radiator. These should generally be reserved for aftermarket radiator users.

What about decreasing the temperature rating of the thermostat? These are generally not needed by the average or above average user. These are more for advanced users with greater cooling requirements due to racing applications or highly modified vehicles. When you get to this point, you will find the shortcomings of the OEM cooling system and will determine which thermostat best suits your needs. This link and this link provide lot of good information on switching to a cooler thermostat. Many also consider this to be a reliability modificiation even on a stock vehicle.

What about aftermarket radiators? These are generally not needed by the average or above average user. These are more for advanced users with greater cooling requirements due to racing applications or highly modified vehicles. When you get to this point, you will find the shortcomings of the OEM cooling system and will determine which radiator best suits your needs. They are a great upgrade for the weak plastic end tank equipped OEM radiator though, so if OEM failure occurs, an aftermarket unit is worth looking into. Popular manufacturers include:

ARC

Blitz

C&R

Fluidyne

Gimmick Motorsports

Griffin

Koyo

Mishimoto

PWR

What about aftermarket or "slim" fans? Just say no. Always use OEM fans as aftermarket fans usually negate the good effects of an aftermarket radiator. This thread shows the basics of stock fans = good, aftermarket fans = bad.

How often should I change my coolant? Refer to and use the maintenance schedule in your owner's manual for Subaru coolant. For other coolant, refer to the coolant manufacturer's recommendation.

How do I replace my coolant?

Page 4 of this Subaru .pdf document also provides coolant replacement tips.

This webpage details coolant swaps, and radiator and thermostat swaps that may be helpful.

This link also has a step by step fluid replacement guide.

Any tips on avoiding air pockets in the coolant system? This thread has some great tips.

What about a DIY coolant flush? There are generally three ways to perform this:

a. After the system is drained, many fill up the radiator with regular or distilled water alone. Then heat cycle, cool, and drain.

b. After the system is drained, fill up the radiator with a "radiator flush" product and water. Then heat cycle, cool, and drain, and then run clear water through to wash out any traces of the product.

c. After the system is drained, fill up the radiator with a 50/50 ratio of white distilled vinegar and water. Then heat cycle, cool, drain, and then run clear water through to wash out the vinegar. The vinegar is acidic enough to remove any scale or impurities, but not harsh enough to harm your seals and gaskets. Many users believe this type of flush to be gentler than commercially obtainable "radiator flush" products.

Flushes as described above should only be performed by advanced users.

Should I perform a coolant flush? Not needed at all and in fact SOA recommends against it according to this TSB. However in a later TSB, 01-166-08, says "Subaru of America, Inc. is proud to announce the approval of the Wynn's PowerFlush III coolant exchange machine. The PowerFlush III was chosen for it's three separate tanks that allow the ability to perform a clean water flush of the cooling system in Subaru vehicles. A clean water flush is possible by filling one tank with fresh water, one tank with new coolant and one tank used for removed liquids." Other machine can/do re-use fluids and as discussed above mixing fluids is a bad thing. So....if you want a machine flush, ensure the shop has a Wynn PowerFlush III, otherwise just say no.

What about topping off my system? Don't sweat it. Just add water and be done with it as the minor amount of water you add isn't enough to dilute your overall coolant capacity enough to change much. If you are super worried anyway, you could top it off with pre-mixed coolant, but that's a little on the "it puts the lotion in the basket" side. And if you think you need to add .1 ounces of Subaru Cooling System Conditioner when you top off...you might want to get a new tin foil hat.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showpost.p...amp;postcount=1

[Prami]

Good article bro

[xXx]

If you live in or around Colombo, why don't you take it to a reputed Service centre and get both things done machang. Saves you this headache of wondering about it. I got my car's coolant flushed at PTStoP for 5000 bucks and no complaints. They do a proper job. Even AtuMiraj does the same kind of work. Take the guessing out of the equation and just do it.

will you be contributing to the bill afterward machang????

[xXx]

true that manual method does not remove most of ATF (including oil inside torque converter) but most of the techs that i talk to me strongly advised against using a flushing machine to remove ATF. They said that it could damage (most machines use pressurized system to remove oil) torque converter and certain valves. And using a machine in high mileage auto box could cause serious trouble it seems. maybe thats why most of the agents not using this technique to remove oil.

i've been told certain censors (something along the lines of shift control module, what ever that means) can be damaged too through this process