Alternator Charging

[rameez]

Hi all,

I have a small clarification to be sorted out.I have a Lancer A72 station wagon, last saturday after an 18Km drive the car suddenly stalled, with the speed it was going i managed to pull it sideways in the road and then tried to start the engine it did not , i mean i can see the charge light ( red) but the engine does not crank just a shake. I then got a guy from a battery shop who came and fixed another fully charged battery in parallel with the existing one and told me to start it , and it did fire up at once.

Later we drove to the shop he came from and he checked the started motor and said that my battery is dead he kept the multimeter in the contacts and told me to raise the engine ,i also saw that the old battery is still giving a reading of 12V.A few months back the battery was dead and i had to clear out the acid and refill it from the very same shop.It was OK for about 2 months until this incident.However i must admit that occasionally if the engine stops in traffic due to clutch missing by me it was a bit hard to start , maybe after 2 attempts it come back to life.I thought this was ok.As at now there is no issue with the new battery which is seal type that i got for 8200 LKR 45AH.

1)Do you think it is normal for a car can stop suddenly even if the battery is low. I thought that we will have problems starting it again and as long it is running it gets the current from the alternator.

2) is there any problem with my alternaotor , how can we check that.

3)can anyone recommend a mechanic to check this out around colombo , i stay in dehiwela.

4) how long do i need to run for a battery to be charged.18km is ok ?

5) does the current from the spark plug come from the alternator or battery, is that why my car stalled ?

any expert please advice, i am a bit baffeled.

rameez

[rameez]

the joys of vehicle ownership mate. we've all been there done that

12.5v is too low afaik cos the battery voltage alone should be over that provided it's in good shape.

Quite possibly your battery must've been weakened due to the alternator issues you've been having.

After running about a bit, if your battery has charged up properly... when the engine is running you should get 14v or so at the battery terminals. This is with no electrical equipment running.

my battery is new FYI, i need to get hold of a multimeter and test it my self.

[Ripper]

my battery is new FYI, i need to get hold of a multimeter and test it my self.

it maybe new but if the alternator wasn't working properly all this time...chances are it wasn't charged fully when they checked it.

[rameez]

it maybe new but if the alternator wasn't working properly all this time...chances are it wasn't charged fully when they checked it.

yes that makes sense

[rameez]

hunting for a vehicle at least a temporary one to use in new year days till i get my hands on a good euro.

You said the inner coil has replaced or rather re-winded. This 12.5 is sort of bare minimum. This figure can considered ok provided that all electrics were switched on. However, with electrics switched off it should at least pump 13v out to keep the battery in good health.

yes machan that is a bit of a worry to me as well, i hope pala knows what they do. I mean there is a lot of positive feedback about them and also they seem to do a lot of agent jobs as well.

however one thing i am not that happy is the labor which is a bit high for me , but then beggars cant be choosers.

one more thing is that say the voltage is at 12.5v and we use it in the night does that mean alternator is powering the vehicle the whole time???

[The Stig]

one more thing is that say the voltage is at 12.5v and we use it in the night does that mean alternator is powering the vehicle the whole time???

The battery and the alternator are both coupled together, they dont work alone under load.

So if you mean under load by "use it in the night" most probably both will be handle the load

[harshansenadhir]

yes machan that is a bit of a worry to me as well, i hope pala knows what they do. I mean there is a lot of positive feedback about them and also they seem to do a lot of agent jobs as well.

however one thing i am not that happy is the labor which is a bit high for me , but then beggars cant be choosers.

one more thing is that say the voltage is at 12.5v and we use it in the night does that mean alternator is powering the vehicle the whole time???

Again, if this 12.5V reading comes when all equipments were switched on, then it can be considered ok but it's not the ideal voltage. Go to a battery shop and ask them to check charging while all equipments switched off as well as switched on. Under the full load, it reads 12.5, that's sufficient and as I said, bare minimum.

It doesn't mean the alternator powering the system, but it compensates the electrical demand in the system by filling up the battery.

[harshansenadhir]

So no backup vehicle after the 406 ?

if you see my updated signature you would notice that the lancer is no more around yeah, both were gone in just two consecutive days. No back up other than the bicycle

[Sylvi]

Members,

Can buy a Alternator used in Japan in good working order from used spare parts shops for Rupees 3000.00 to 4500.00. Depending on the amperage.

I think The A/L Member had spent about Rupees 2750.00 extra money on the Alternator repair Rupees 2500.00 for labor charges and rewound Stator coil and brush holder Rupees 3500.00 is the normal charge.

Voltage should be when you accelerate the engine 14.5 DC maximum if it is more battery will start to evaporate water and have to keep on filling distilled water. If this high voltage continues for some time Alternator coil diode pack and battery too can get affected.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[rameez]

Members,

Can buy a Alternator used in Japan in good working order from used spare parts shops for Rupees 3000.00 to 4500.00. Depending on the amperage.

I think The A/L Member had spent about Rupees 2750.00 extra money on the Alternator repair Rupees 2500.00 for labor charges and rewound Stator coil and brush holder Rupees 3500.00 is the normal charge.

Voltage should be when you accelerate the engine 14.5 DC maximum if it is more battery will start to evaporate water and have to keep on filling distilled water. If this high voltage continues for some time Alternator coil diode pack and battery too can get affected.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

are you telling me that i got cheated. the other thing is that a new alternator for the lancer box costs around 10000 , as per that guy in the garage.anyway sylvi as to my knowledge alternators are a bit expensive as to my knowledge,do you know of any places

Edited April 11, 2011 by rameez

[Ripper]

Members,

Can buy a Alternator used in Japan in good working order from used spare parts shops for Rupees 3000.00 to 4500.00. Depending on the amperage.

I think The A/L Member had spent about Rupees 2750.00 extra money on the Alternator repair Rupees 2500.00 for labor charges and rewound Stator coil and brush holder Rupees 3500.00 is the normal charge.

Voltage should be when you accelerate the engine 14.5 DC maximum if it is more battery will start to evaporate water and have to keep on filling distilled water. If this high voltage continues for some time Alternator coil diode pack and battery too can get affected.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

Sylvi

i think you have some good contacts to get an alternator for that cheap. I busted an alternator on my corolla sometime back and a replacement from a breaker joint was a lot more than the price you've quoted here. My memory is a bit dodgy over the price but i was quoted somewhere around 10,000 to 12,500 range.

Also getting an alternator from those breaker joints have a few dis advantages when compared to getting a burnt one fully rebuilt at a place like pala.

you get a warranty for about 6 months from a place like pala and this is not available from a breaker joint.

all the components like bearings, circuitry that goes into the rebuilt alternator is brand new so chances of failure are less than that of a used alternator.

In fact the only components of a rebuilt alternator that are used is the housing and the coil pack.

For these reasons...i would prefer a rebuilt alternator any day over a breaker yard alternator although a rebuilt one almost always ends up slightly more expensive.

This is not to start an argument btw... just my thoughts

cheers

ripper

[Sylvi]

Sylvi

i think you have some good contacts to get an alternator for that cheap. I busted an alternator on my corolla sometime back and a replacement from a breaker joint was a lot more than the price you've quoted here. My memory is a bit dodgy over the price but i was quoted somewhere around 10,000 to 12,500 range.

Also getting an alternator from those breaker joints have a few dis advantages when compared to getting a burnt one fully rebuilt at a place like pala.

you get a warranty for about 6 months from a place like pala and this is not available from a breaker joint.

all the components like bearings, circuitry that goes into the rebuilt alternator is brand new so chances of failure are less than that of a used alternator.

In fact the only components of a rebuilt alternator that are used is the housing and the coil pack.

For these reasons...i would prefer a rebuilt alternator any day over a breaker yard alternator although a rebuilt one almost always ends up slightly more expensive.

This is not to start an argument btw... just my thoughts

cheers

'Ripper,

I appreciate your comment. Other members also will know the cost to pay. Pala had built up a name in auto electrical industry for last twenty years I am in Automobile service industry will write my Estimate on repairing a Alternator.

I was in Auto and heavy Industrial Electrical maintenance business since my father expired. Carried on his work shop until I brought the technology from USA what I am active now in Automobile industry.Have had Repaired more than 20000 Alternators during my Electrical days In a Alternator mostly stator coil get burnt off. Very rarely diode pack and rotor coil will get damage Ball racers only the front one on drive end side will be necessary to change two brushes if it is serviceable I leave them I never change unnecessary parts on a unit if it has 50% usable time. I still have all testing equipment for any electrical maintenance for a automobiles.

The last Vehicle I used Alternator stator coil got burnt off I had a serviceable alternator of 35 amps fitted same and vent in searching of alternators in Delkanda area shops. They Quoted 85 Amps Rupees 4500.00 to 10000.00 went to some more shops then I came across a person quoted me a alternator from a car engine as he had sold most of the parts of that engine Rupees 5000.00 for 75 amps. He said if it is not working he will give me a another one. I requested to dismantle and examine same he said OK then I dismantled the alternator in front of him. found only front end ball bearing was wasted he reduced Rupees 500.00. Till I sold the Vehicle I had the same but the in build IC regulator was not functioning to my requirement as that was giving only 13.5 Volts DC. That IC regulator was replaced after three months due to night running I had a difficulty as I was using 100 Watt Head lamps with rainy days with wiper on in the night Alternator was not producing enough current.I changed to electric mechanical regulator which was Rupees 850.00.

Alternator Stator coil winding materiel cost only Rupees 500.00 maximum.Can pay for a good experienced Coil winder Rupees 1000.00 for rewinding one unit 2 alternator stators can be wound for 8 hours with the help of a helper or 1 can finish off by a single experienced Coil winder in one day. Repairing a Alternator is matter of two hours if you have all necessary spares for a repair.Removing refitting from the vehicle final test another 2 hours total Half days job. That is the reason I quoted with all over heads that amount for labour.For alternator job you need only two persons.Maximum labour cost To the service center is Rupees.1500.00.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[rameez]

Again, if this 12.5V reading comes when all equipments were switched on, then it can be considered ok but it's not the ideal voltage. Go to a battery shop and ask them to check charging while all equipments switched off as well as switched on. Under the full load, it reads 12.5, that's sufficient and as I said, bare minimum.

It doesn't mean the alternator powering the system, but it compensates the electrical demand in the system by filling up the battery.

Well today finally being a holiday i got hold of a multimeter, and did some readings with it.

when i keep the engine in idle with nothing switched on 12.45/12.55/12.33 were the voltages

when i raise the engine a bit nothing switched on 12.86/12.95/13.02

when i keep the head light and the blower fan in idle 12.2/12/11.98

when i raise the engine with all switched on 12.5/12.45/12.66/12.75

so is this ok.

i also have another query along with this which arose , that is assume my life style is such that i only drive in the night( maybe we can assume the job), i continuously do it for three month meaning i drive in the night with all lights switched on and also the stereo , AC on whenever i drive.my driving is also in the city with no much accelerating,the million dollar question is can the battery go down.we shall assume a new car bought brand new.

[Ripper]

i suppose that sounds ok...

what's the battery voltage when the car isn't running.

say if you were to check it in the morning...

[Sylvi]

i suppose that sounds ok...

what's the battery voltage when the car isn't running.

say if you were to check it in the morning...

"Ripper",

Your Post is correct. I cannot not assume the setting of the IC regulator voltage. Yes he must check in the morning after night run with all his Vehicle electrical equipment load. When the Vehicle engine is cold not started.

His 12.75 Volts DC means the Alternator is compensating the draw of Current for the equipment of his Vehicle.

I can give one advice use a battery trickle charger on the car during the night then battery will be in full for rest of the day use Battery life time too will be extended.Check for battery water regularly.

Imported unit Cost will be Rupees 2500.00 to 4500.00. If you buy the 12 Volts step down from 230 volts 1 ampere transformer, 40 DC volts 10 amp Full wave Diode pack with a 5 Amp DC meter and wire the circuit with your self it will cost Rupees 1250.00 Any Radio spare parts shop on 1st cross street Colombo will have all what you want.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.