What's the difference between Sunny HB12 and FB12

[Kyan]

Hello hello, back from the dead again 👋, while I was searching for the Trads I often saw the model names as FB & HB, what's the difference between those two?

Thank you

[matroska]

This was discussed previously 

 

[Kyan]

11 hours ago, matroska said:

This was discussed previously 

 

Perfect, thank you man - also many people refer to them as just "B12", is there another model named B12 or are they saying that to all of these models?

[iRage]

8 hours ago, Kyan said:

Perfect, thank you man - also many people refer to them as just "B12", is there another model named B12 or are they saying that to all of these models?

I don't think that thread actually answers your question...

B12 = 1300cc E13(S?) engine model. Came with either a 4-speed manual or 3-speed automatic (in SL most automatics were converted to manuals)

This would have come in lower grades like the DX, GL, EX Saloon trim levels.

HB12 = 1500cc E15S and E15E engine models (and E15T for the Turbo Super Saloon). Came with a 3-speed automatic across the trim range or with a 5-speed manual. The Super Saloon (for the most part) came with a 4-speed automatic or a 5-speed manual (I believe there was a time the Super Saloon with the E15S engine also had the 3-speed automatic...but that might have been for the AWD variant)

The E15 engine was available in the preface life variant. So you are looking at 1985 to about 1987 model years.

This was available across the trim levels..so DX, GL, SGL, SGXE,Super Saloon. However NOT the EX Saloon. The EX Saloon was sort of reserved to be the high-end trim level for the 1300xx variant.

FB12 = 1500cc GA15S and GA15E engine models.

The E15 engine was replaced with the updated GA15 engine for the facelift. So FB12s would be late 1987 onwards.

Like the HB12, the FB 12 was available in various trim levels, including DX, EX Saloon, SX Saloon, and Super Saloon.

The E is the E15E and GA15E denotes electronic fuel injection. The E15E and GA15E were offered only in the Super Saloon (and I think in the SGXE in the pre-facelift).

SB12 = 1700cc C17 diesel engine variant which came with either a 3-speed automatic or a 5-speed manual gearbox. It was available across the trim range so you would find SB12 DX, GL, SGL, EX Saloon and Super Saloon variants.

 

 

[Kyan]

2 hours ago, iRage said:

I don't think that thread actually answers your question...

B12 = 1300cc E13(S?) engine model. Came with either a 4-speed manual or 3-speed automatic (in SL most automatics were converted to manuals)

This would have come in lower grades like the DX, GL, EX Saloon trim levels.

HB12 = 1500cc E15S and E15E engine models (and E15T for the Turbo Super Saloon). Came with a 3-speed automatic across the trim range or with a 5-speed manual. The Super Saloon (for the most part) came with a 4-speed automatic or a 5-speed manual (I believe there was a time the Super Saloon with the E15S engine also had the 3-speed automatic...but that might have been for the AWD variant)

The E15 engine was available in the preface life variant. So you are looking at 1985 to about 1987 model years.

This was available across the trim levels..so DX, GL, SGL, SGXE,Super Saloon. However NOT the EX Saloon. The EX Saloon was sort of reserved to be the high-end trim level for the 1300xx variant.

FB12 = 1500cc GA15S and GA15E engine models.

The E15 engine was replaced with the updated GA15 engine for the facelift. So FB12s would be late 1987 onwards.

Like the HB12, the FB 12 was available in various trim levels, including DX, EX Saloon, SX Saloon, and Super Saloon.

The E is the E15E and GA15E denotes electronic fuel injection. The E15E and GA15E were offered only in the Super Saloon (and I think in the SGXE in the pre-facelift).

SB12 = 1700cc C17 diesel engine variant which came with either a 3-speed automatic or a 5-speed manual gearbox. It was available across the trim range so you would find SB12 DX, GL, SGL, EX Saloon and Super Saloon variants.

 

 

Oh wow! thank you so much for this, truly helps out alot - also do you happen to the known issues in those cars?, many people also told me don't even think of getting one for 1.3 Mil cause there shitty and so on lol

 

[iRage]

21 hours ago, Kyan said:

Oh wow! thank you so much for this, truly helps out alot - also do you happen to the known issues in those cars?, many people also told me don't even think of getting one for 1.3 Mil cause there shitty and so on lol

 

Well...the B12 Sunny serious is actually a pretty decent car. The engine was no frills and the higher trim levels were much better spec'd than its competition (Corolla, Lancer, etc..). At the time it was a class leader in many regards (the B11 Sunny was so bad that Nissan design the B12 Sunny to revive the true sense of the Sunny so they went to town with the design...TRAD in the TRAD Sunny stands for Traditional).

Here are the issues though...

1. As with any car of the period, the cars were prone to rust (after all this time, it should be no shock). Sadly, those who owned these cars were cost-conscious people, so they didn't spend that much on fixing the car properly. Most of the cars of the 80s and 90s are sculptured with putty/body-filler.

2. The carb! In the mid-90s, anyone and everyone who knew how to fix a carburetor seemed to have been abducted by aliens. Cars with carburetors were the ultimate victims of all this. At the time, Nissan was rolling out its PLASMA engines, so the carburetors were a bit more complicated than for a Morris Minor or a KE20. Sadly after rebuilds and replacements by incompetent mechanics most of the cars simply did not run properly. Mind you, this problem exists with pretty much every carbureted car in the country...getting them properly set up is nearly impossible. Add in things like LASRE, PLASMA, etc..things get worse.

3. Electroncis...c'mon. You are looking at an econo-box that is 30+ years old with 101 past owners sticking in stereo to light upgrades and splicing up cables. Also...at 30+ years of age things like connectors would have gotten worn out too.

As a general rule you should be weary about purchasing any car that is significantly below (or even above) the average market value.

[matroska]

On 7/21/2024 at 7:50 AM, iRage said:

don't think that thread actually answers your question...

errm it actually does answer his initial question ... Davy had repiled 

"

HB12: This has Nissan's E series engine 1.5L. The engine was discontinued in the mid 80s I think. 

FB12: After the E series engine was discontinued, the Sunny came with the newer GA series engine. The FB12 has the GA engine and is more desirable than the (older) E series engine."

On 7/21/2024 at 7:50 AM, iRage said:

most automatics were converted to manuals

Sadly, automatics put the fear of god in the average Sri Lankan Mechanic right up to the dawn of the new millenium...in FACT a relative who worked as a foreman for an agent in SL upon learning we bought a B14 series sunny with an automatic gearbox was like 'Why ? Why? Why would you make such a mistake?"   it's funny how the tables have turned now with automatics fetching at least a couple of hundred thousand more than the manuals. There are thankfully at least half a  dozen or so original automatic  are Trad Sunnys(Sunnies/Sunnae) surviving - there are also a few transplanted with latter version GA15 and CD17 engine-gearbox combos. Given that the transmissions are old and mucked up my non-competent mechanics , it might be wise to stay away from them now though. 

 

22 hours ago, Kyan said:

many people also told me don't even think of getting one for 1.3 Mil cause there shitty and so on lol

Well usually something in pristine condition would cost much more than 1.3M - which is why people advice you against it. These cars are used by people with limited budgets, hence the cheaper ones may be poorly maintained  But then again overpriced cars hardly move. The current trend seems to be a high demand for automatic hatchbacks, with K plates. So a manual sedan, with a humble 16 - plate will not be the most sought after, presenting you the chance to bargain for it. 

[iRage]

3 hours ago, matroska said:

Why ? Why? Why would you make such a mistake?"

I would say the same thing about the B14...why ? why ? Why would you make such a mistake ??

The B14 was an abomination (compared to the B13)...the transmission was made out of plastic, and everything except the engine block was prone to break. The only plus point was that a monkey with a wrench could fix it with some rubber bands and rope ⠀...no, seriously. It was really that bad. We had fleets of them, and they all broke despite tons of money being put into PROPER maintenance. The E100 and E110 Taxi Corollas faired a lot better.

Edited July 22 by iRage

[matroska]

40 minutes ago, iRage said:

everything except the engine block was prone to break. The only plus point was that a monkey with a wrench could fix it with some rubber bands and rope ⠀...no, seriously. It was really that bad.

At the dawn of the new millennium the B14 and B15 were all the rage  - mind you the one we had was pristine cosmetic condition - that we picked it over a Tercel that was 100,000 cheaper.  The relative was of course shocked that we would buy an auto. 

Funny thing is the B14 only broke down once - that was when the alternator packed up - that too en-route to nuwara eliya  - that mentally scarring episode aside it was as trouble free as it gets. (the only car that I have used  gave less trouble was my Honda fit GP1) Had it for a decade and the thing just kept running - mind you this was the pariah-version : The B14, powered with a GA13 engine and an old school auto-box it was a lumbering simpleton but it never really gave trouble 

[matroska]

On 7/22/2024 at 9:15 AM, iRage said:

B14...why ? why ? Why would you make such a mistake ??

going horribly OT now but I cannot resist