Kettle Whistling Sound When The Engine Is Hot - Allion

[djpra123]

Dear Experts,

So much stuff I have learnt from you guys browsing though old threads so far, but this exact issue I had to ask since I found the existing as bit deviated from my car's problem.

This is a dual vvti engine allion and when I bought it few days back I took it to TL Maharagama to do a full inspection. But they were all booked (saw an ad later that its a free inspection for that week) so only managed to get "the expert who does the driving test" of the vehicle. This gentlemen did a visual inspection of the vehicle and said there must be a leak in the water pump. Then took it out side and drove on different road conditions while the shutter is down to hear any sounds and we were able to hear a sound like a kettle whistle when the engine is hot. Odometer says its still 50k and with the original battery (TL guy said this came with the exact brand) so a water pump issue as I've learnt from old threads, must not have happened in such milleage.

Then I took it to Auto M** Pepiliyana, and showed it to one of their experts and when the engine was cold no sounds at all and he checked the pulley and the surrounding area and said no sign of such a leak.

1. Anyone had this experience before where there is a coolant leak or whistle sound when the engine is hot?

2. Is it an expensive repair?

3. Whom should I show this?

**********************

On a separate note, I have only one smart key, thought to make another one and found the price tag clost to 18k. Anyone knows a good place? I have seen so many ads in hitA* pages but don't know if they are trust worthy.

[Crosswind]

Are u checking the water levels in the radiator regularly? Are the water levels ok?

[Rumesh88]

It is time for tea is n't it? On a more serious note if you expect the noise to come from a leaky coolant path, then as Crosswind above had asked there will definitely be an appreciable coolant loss because to make an audible noise there has to be a serious leak. Also when there is a coolant loss anywhere in the visible area of the engine you would see the dye marks (red or green) left behind by the leaking coolant. You may test the system by opening the radiator cap before a drive when the engine is cold and checking if the coolant is filled up to the brim. If not fill up with some water (preferably distilled), close the cap and take the car for a drive of more than 10 minutes. (Check for sufficient coolant in the fill-up tank as well). Allow the engine to cool down for several hours and check the water level at the cap again. If there is a leak anywhere in the radiator system the coolant level would be below the brim. Is the whistling noise goes up and down in frequency when you rev up the engine. If so the issue could be in a bearing.

[djpra123]

Thanks for the quick responses.

Coolant level seems to be not going down much. It's only been 3 days I am using this (less than 50kms) I did not see any red color spots on any of the clooant lines. Have to rev up the engine and see. If its a minor leak wouldn't the coolant level drop be less visible?

Tnx once again.

[varunatech]

Hi, does this sound come from the engine bay only. Because the same type of sound comes when the small Air Filter of the Fuel cap get clogged. Simple way to check is, to losen the Fuel cap a bit to make sure air is drawn through the opening. Let me know the details, have sorted this issue.

[Crosswind]

No matter how minor the leak is, coolant level will have a significant drop. So you need to leave the cooling system out.

Both varunatech and Rumesh have given worthwhile investigations...

[harshansenadhir]

take it to a spin with A/C switched off (engine would run hotter this way than when the A/C is on and auxiliary fans are working all the time) and see whether you can hear the sound. If you hear it, shut off the engine and see whether sound disappears all of a sudden or gradually gets reduced.

If it disappears suddenly, it's a vaccum leak somewhere, brake booster vaccum line and other vaccum lines and IDC valve in the throttle body to be looked at.

however, if the sound faints as time passes from the point of engine shut off, that's a sound of a pressure leak in the engine cooling system.

[djpra123]

Thanks a lot for the information guys. Will get back with further observations soon using your investigation instructions.

[djpra123]

Hi Guys,

Went to Kandy and down south (around 600+kms) but I did not hear the noise when the engine heat is up. However I saw a red residue deposit on the bonnet and further observation revealed that this could occur when coolant dropped to one of the belts and it is flashing coolant around the engine bay. Can’t spot the exact belt. Still the coolant level on the external container is half way to LOW level (it was not on the FULL when I post this so can’t say how much has leaked etc).

- Anyone you know around Nugegoda area to show this to or should I visit the agents (which I don't like)? Or the radiator guy in Nawala road can sort this?

- Is this the water pump issue? High costly repair?

Thanks

[Sylvi]

  On 2/3/2014 at 8:27 AM, djpra123 said:

Hi Guys,

Went to Kandy and down south (around 600+kms) but I did not hear the noise when the engine heat is up. However I saw a red residue deposit on the bonnet and further observation revealed that this could occur when coolant dropped to one of the belts and it is flashing coolant around the engine bay. Can’t spot the exact belt. Still the coolant level on the external container is half way to LOW level (it was not on the FULL when I post this so can’t say how much has leaked etc).

- Anyone you know around Nugegoda area to show this to or should I visit the agents (which I don't like)? Or the radiator guy in Nawala road can sort this?

- Is this the water pump issue? High costly repair?

Thanks

djpra123,

To my knowledge there is no problem in your vehicle according to your post.

If there is any problem you cannot do 600 Kilometers with heating and radiator.

Do not go to any one observe for few days. Post again the developments.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[djpra123]

Hi Sylvi,

This 600km is not at one stretch. This includes CMB city rides, trips to office for past few weeks and the long trips to Kandy and down south. This red colored residue is a sign of coolant deposits, isn’t it?

Thanks

[Crosswind]

Not sure what an Allion engine bay looks like so I am gonna state the obvious. It sounds like your car has an external coolant tank. If so, there may be a pinhole size leak in the tank, from a hose or the connector between the hose and the tank. I faced a similar issue with a very old car I had. All I did was buy a tube of JB Weld and cover up the pinhole. Never had to look at it again.

Is it an oily residue or just a residue like a dye? If it is an oily residue, the only red oil in your car is the auto transmission oil. The only way auto transmission oil can get in to the hood is if it is over filled and if there is a leak from the dipstick (assuming allion has a dipstick. both my cars dont have auto gear oil dipsticks).

I am not an expert in the cooling system but I seriously don't think its an issue with the water pump.

[MkX]

I think you need to check your coolant lines again. Press rubber hoses and see how the elasticity. If they are hard and if you can feel dry or burnt feeling in your fingers (kara wela) they might have tiny leaks. If you have your coolant level drops in every few hundreads of KMs meaning that your radiator running on low pressure/high temp. This will sure cause a leak/crack in top tank or leak in the seal betweek top tank and radiator core.

My suggestion is to closely check hoses and replace if you suspect they are leaky.

[Sylvi]

  On 2/3/2014 at 10:10 AM, djpra123 said:

Hi Sylvi,

This 600km is not at one stretch. This includes CMB city rides, trips to office for past few weeks and the long trips to Kandy and down south. This red colored residue is a sign of coolant deposits, isn’t it?

Thanks

djpra123,

What is the color of your coolant. They normally are green. Red colored residue cannot be what you suspect.

Well two other experienced members (Crosswind and MkX) have given their ideas about your problem. First of all check what they had recommended.

I do suspect what Crosswind had mentioned that transmission oil red color, can be the color of you say on the bonnet.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[djpra123]

First of all thanks a lot for your guidence everyone.

Sylvi,

Coolant color is red. Can not be transmission oil. It's not a oily residue. Like a powder of redish white splashed on the bonnet and surrounding area.

I did check the lines connecting to cooling system and other hints given to check the vaccum leaks (With A/C turned off etc). Couldn't figure it out still. A/C line is also going close to these pullys and could this be water drops from it, but where can the red color add to it

Thought to take it to a radiator guy to get it checked or find some garage near my area (Old J*ki is near in Pepiliyana but now they have a new management and no experience with them). Maybe an expert can spot it far quickly than me . As I said my experience with agents and AutoM is not good.

Thanks..

[peugeot407]

Perform a pressure test on your cooling system.If there is leak it can be easily detected by this test.

To**ta L*nk* performed this on my Hilux and only charged Rs 1000

[Sylvi]

djpra123,

You have got first class advice from a member to clear all your doubtful thoughts.

By a A/L member peugeot407.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[djpra123]

Thanks for you suggestion peugeot407. It might be my last option. Anyways here are some images of the engine bay.

You can see the red color residue on the belts and pulley.

Did not see a leak in the coolant line or the rubber hoses. Any idea if you can get with these images?

Thanks.

[Ruslan]

  On 2/4/2014 at 10:29 AM, djpra123 said:

Thanks for you suggestion peugeot407. It might be my last option. Anyways here are some images of the engine bay.

[img=http://s28.postimg.org/xsaqm5g19/Car_Bay2.jpg]

You can see the red color residue on the belts and pulley.

[img=http://s29.postimg.org/pq4l4nkon/Car_Bay3.jpg]

Did not see a leak in the coolant line or the rubber hoses. Any idea if you can get with these images?

Thanks.

Hmmm that looks like your water pumps gasket gone bad.. It's 2ZR-FE engine right? Edited February 4, 2014 by Ruslan

[nano31]

I too had water pump leak in my CE 110 diesel, strangely it was only when the engine is cool, NOT when it is hot.

It was only once in 2 week with prolong parking, when it was really cool down.

I use my engine with that leak for 2yrs with close observation!

I replace the pump (at the time of engine repair) with "Asian", made in Japan, it cost nearly 6500/=, at Toyota Lanka it was nearly 24000/=/.

I suggest you to get it replaced with it original Asian, made in Japan, it is not that big job and you need to refill the coolant after repair.

[djpra123]

Thanks Ruslan and Nano31 for your feedback.

As I mentioned in the opening post, TL inspector said this must be a leak in water pump but even he was not sure why in such millage. Anyways if its the problem I have to address it without thinking how it happened now. As you said the cost he said is around 25k. Since this is a dual-vvti 1.8 engine, I'm not sure about the experience and cost of parts for this type of repair and if this leads to another job inside the engine, I will be doomed!! :sad-smiley-068: :sad-smiley-068:

SO thought of going to Ratmalana TL and ask if they have parts to replace it and if they do, do the job in a little while(Say good bye to the bonus )

Thanks once again..!

[djpra123]

Found a video of such a replacement. Thought to share for anyone's interest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNgQdGJyBDs

Edited February 4, 2014 by djpra123

[nano31]

djpra123,

Buy original Asian brand pump from a reputed shop, any competent mechanic would do it, Total cost will be VERY MUCH lesser than what they offer at TL(plz note that mine is CE 110, diesel, old 2C engine, 24000 is only the price of the pump not the total cost!).

There is no magic Toyota ppl do at their shop but the cost matter, you will be alright as long as you got good quality Japanese spares (OEM products).

Edited February 5, 2014 by nano31