"Honda Civic 2017 (Gen X) 1.5L Turbo"

[kmeeg]

<Will add a new reply>

 

Edited July 7, 2018 by kmeeg

[kmeeg]

I know everyone will laugh at this because I could have called anyone as a automobile engineer.

Anyways to take it or forget it here is a response from my friend who is an automobile engineer. I have black-out the names for privacy. 

Note - I'm not trying to prove that turbo is bad. I just asked a friend about his opinion on long term reliability based on what he has studied.

 

[iRage]

10 hours ago, kmeeg said:

I know everyone will laugh at this because I could have called anyone as a automobile engineer.

Anyways to take it or forget it here is a response from my friend who is an automobile engineer. I have black-out the names for privacy. 

Note - I'm not trying to prove that turbo is bad. I just asked a friend about his opinion on long term reliability based on what he has studied.

 

Yes...the turbo charged Subarus and Starlets have all perished whilst our loving 1800cc Carina/Bluebird and 1500cc Doctor Corollas keep running

Again...different technology.....requiring different behavior. Yes..these cars do not work for Sri Lanka as 95% of our car owners are thel higannas who are stuck in the 1980s a.

At the end of the day...none of us know what will happen. the Euros and the Japanese that have had similar tech have survived for the last few decades. So rather than holding on to outdated notions and speculating on the unknown and making people panic...lets just let the trend go on. We are minuscule entities in the vast automobile world. So take it or leave it....

Edited July 7, 2018 by iRage

[ajm]

15 hours ago, kmeeg said:

here is a response from my friend who is an automobile engineer

is he driving a new-gen 1L Turbo?

I have a strong doubt if this is from Mr.Potato-estate ?

[kmeeg]

1 hour ago, ajm said:

is he driving a new-gen 1L Turbo?

I have a strong doubt if this is from Mr.Potato-estate ?

?? Not sure about potatoe case.

[Quiet]

people said the same kinda stuff when Automatic Transmission came. I specifically remember in 2011 when i was looking to buy a hybrid most people said that system will get damaged by water/battery will die etc etc. Since then i have bought and sold two hybrids, Sky active Mazda and now own a Turbo. 

I dont think these guys look at so many aspects when they select a wife. (Leave aside the second hand value) 

[BuBi]

On 7/9/2018 at 10:29 AM, Quiet said:

people said the same kinda stuff when Automatic Transmission came. I specifically remember in 2011 when i was looking to buy a hybrid most people said that system will get damaged by water/battery will die etc etc. Since then i have bought and sold two hybrids, Sky active Mazda and now own a Turbo. 

I dont think these guys look at so many aspects when they select a wife. (Leave aside the second hand value) 

Well automatics does have problems. Just take a look at the CVT boxes. They are not as reliable as the manuals and they are expensive. There is a reason behind everything. Hybrids are just the same. They are not as reliable as there ICE counterparts specially in longevity. 

[BuBi]

On 7/6/2018 at 5:25 PM, iRage said:

Again...you are over simplifying things in many ways. Your statement touches base on the simple fact that there are plenty of people who are stuck in the 80s and 90s and not willing to change their behavior and instead blame and shame the technology.

Yes...cars and production methodologies and everything has changed...Yes..cars are built in a manner that they can be easily recyclable, lighter using lighter material....but that does not necessarily mean it has gotten weaker or worst. They cannot be used in a way that you used a car from a decade ago (just like you can't use a present day Allion/Premio the same way you used a Carina from the 80s).

Thinking and saying that the older engines were built strong because they had to build large capacity engines to get X number of hp out of it is a very one dimensional way of looking at it.  We as a human race have actually figured out how to make things stronger with things we traditionally thought were weak. Eg. we can do a lot more things with Aluminium/Alloys which we used to do with pure steel and still make it stronger...

Like I said....certain components will have shortened service cycles; requiring them to be changed, services, etc... a bit lesser than in a N/A engine requiring us uses to change the way we use cars....but that does not mean the car was designed to just last around be unusable beyond 10 years. According to your logic we should expect yards upon yards of these cars rotting away in 10-15 years time because that is what the manufactures are planning (since there won't be any engines to replace the existing ones anyway).Again, not in the best interest of these companies to be so simplistic like that...the loss in reputation is far more costlier and longer term than anything else.  Now...whether we would still be using the current cars in 10-15 years time is a different story...for example if EVs and FCVs actually turn out to be winners then obviously a lot of people will give up theri Turbo charged Civics for Insights, and Leaves....then the fact that we buy cars that were not intended for our markets is a different story altogether.

Again..your point of view is exactly what people said when  new technologies came out. In the late 80s when Japanese cars were going EFI we said the same thing saying the sensors and computers won't last and that the car industry has changed that cars are built flimsily. We said the same thing about Hybrids; that they are made to have shorter lives  because.batteries don't last, interiors are made of plastic to save weight, etc...at the end of the day these cars are still running around. We say the same thing about Japanese kei cars...the turbo charged ones have been around for ages (not in SL..) and you still see them running. 

When the Japanese vehicles were going on and on, we said the same thing about European vehicles...that they are overly complicated, the build quality is weaker, etc...and that they will break down and be inoperable with time...yet we see plenty of them around (except Alfas of course..they just rotted away ..c'mon had to make an Alfa joke)

The reason why the Japanese were not doing it is NOT because they didn't know how to do it...it was because they were doing extensive R&D, in fact down sized turbo charged engines had been show cased by the Japanese since the 80s (that I know of). Just like Hybrids and Electric vehicles were first played with by Mitsubishi since the 70s. 

So..it is not all doom and gloom.

Again...the issue is not with the technology...the issue is with people. People obviously will have old school views and expect to just put oil , petrol and run...(i.e. be cheap about it) and then it will break....and as I said before...it is not the tech that is bad..it is just that people are stuck in the 80s and 90s and are not willing to change with the times and instead blaming it on the present technologies (its not just cars...even our education system is not changing with times and is plagued because people are holding on to a success indicator that should have died of 3 decades ago). 

So lets agree to disagree.

 

 

Well, it's not blaming the technology but coming to terms with it. We don't live in the 90s to expect the tech and wisdom of the 90s. What I say is that the improvement of the technology does not necessarily make the car last a long time. 

Car manufacturers don't make cars to last more than 30-40 years anymore. But, our car market demands vehicles like those. We need to keep this in our minds and be well informed about stuffs like these. It might help us in the long run. 

Vehicles reliability lies in the simplicity of its build. Complicated vehicles are rarely reliable as there are so many parts that could go bust. This is why premium cars like Benz, BMW etc., are nightmares to maintain after more than 4-5 years. There was a time specially around 90s that Japan mainly produced pretty solid and simple cars. Those are the ones which we keep as our yardsticks to compare other vehicles. That must not be done. 

Regarding the OP, the issue is not about why turbo engine with large engine capacity have lasted longer but how will the smaller capacity lighter engines would hold on to associated higher stresses induced by the Turbos which are placed their only to increase the necessary horse power while maintaining good fuel economy. 

[iRage]

1 minute ago, BuBi said:

Well, it's not blaming the technology but coming to terms with it. We don't live in the 90s to expect the tech and wisdom of the 90s. What I say is that the improvement of the technology does not necessarily make the car last a long time. 

Car manufacturers don't make cars to last more than 30-40 years anymore. But, our car market demands vehicles like those. We need to keep this in our minds and be well informed about stuffs like these. It might help us in the long run. 

Vehicles reliability lies in the simplicity of its build. Complicated vehicles are rarely reliable as there are so many parts that could go bust. This is why premium cars like Benz, BMW etc., are nightmares to maintain after more than 4-5 years. There was a time specially around 90s that Japan mainly produced pretty solid and simple cars. Those are the ones which we keep as our yardsticks to compare other vehicles. That must not be done. 

Regarding the OP, the issue is not about why turbo engine with large engine capacity have lasted longer but how will the smaller capacity lighter engines would hold on to associated higher stresses induced by the Turbos which are placed their only to increase the necessary horse power while maintaining good fuel economy. 

I thought you gave them a 10 yea life earlier  Anyway...just teasing you...

Again...lets agree to disagree....we really don't know what the future holds...in reality if we still keep using fossil fuels 30 to 40 years in to the future at the current rate we are at; we won't have a planet to drive on anyway...so its not a problem.  Even in the past the life time was not as high as 30 to 40 years...its just that we kept them running partly out of necessity partly out of desire. 

[kmeeg]

 

 

[Harry (aq)]

13 hours ago, kmeeg said:

 

Thanks, I was about to post this...

 

[ajm]

I personally prefer non-Tubo with bigger capacity compared to Turbo+downsized because of more "natural" acceleration and durability in case of older engines.

 

But there are technologies to circumvent the problems mentioned here.

1. Intercoolers.(in use since a long time)

2. Direct injection with optimized spray patterns to achive mixing

3.Optimized intake manifold design to achive mixing

4.more injections at higher pressure per cylinder stroke

New technologies

1.Water Injection(BMW M4 already using it) to cool the intake

2.Natural compression Ignition(like Diesels, Mazda planning to use first time in Petrol engines in the next Engine series)

[Civic las]

On 6/13/2018 at 11:17 AM, Harry (aq) said:

Update on the 1st service

As I suspected it was a detailed checkup plus a full service without the change of oil. Took about good 4 hours on a Saturday at Rattanapitiya. 

Running Maps on Original System 

I noticed many people with FK1s are asking on activating Gramin maps of SL. In my case the car came with the default maps disabled from setting. But you can enable it easily. But you do not want to do that. I am using Android Auto to run Google maps on the car system. The Android Auto is not offered for SL in Play Store but I used a apk file to download and install Android Auto into my phone. (I will past the link I used below).

https://www.apkmirror.com/apk/google-inc/android-auto/android-auto-3-2-5815-release/android-auto-maps-media-messaging-voice-3-2-581534-release-android-apk-download/download/

Then the phone need to be connected to the USB port under the dashboard for Android Auto to run its full functionality, otherwise if only Bluetooth is used, it will have limited functions (I have only used Bluetooth for calling only). Google maps can be easily run with this set up. I will upload few photos in my car.

Converting Halogen Fog Lamps to LED

Stock fogs in mine are halogen and I am thinking of changing them to LED to match the headlights. Please advice me on where I can get the matching LEDs with conversion kits (if needed) in SL. Thanks

You need cellular data to run Android Auto. But gamin player no need any data activation.

[Harry (aq)]

4 hours ago, Civic las said:

You need cellular data to run Android Auto. But gamin player no need any data activation.

Everyone has access to cellular data this day. which allows the use of most updated comprehensive map application for SL against all other options. 

[Harry (aq)]

Its been sometime since I updated on my experience with Civic 1.5T. The clock is closing on 7,000km now

Fuel Economy (lets get it out of the way)

Its averaging around 8kmpl in Colombo during heavy traffic (with rain these days). But on average it varies between 8kmpl - 9kmpl

Did a trip to Anuradhapura with an overall efficiency of 15.1kmpl over 530km. Going towards A'pura car averaged about 16.5kmpl.

Regular up and down trips to Ingiriya averages around 13kmpl on 120 route > Expressway Kahathuduwa to Gelanigama > Panadura - Rathnapura Road to Ingiriya

2nd Service 

The car indicated I had to do my service by 4,700km but ended up doing the second service after the A'pura trip around 4,900km. This was the 1st oil change of the car and the agent used Mobil 5w30 oil. 

I did notice a slight increase in fuel efficiency after the service (may be its nothing to do with the service). 

Acceleration

Out of curiosity tried timed accelerations 0 - 100 kmph and cruising at 60 - 160kmph on sports mode

0-100 was just above 8 secs without spooling turbo at the start and was just above 7 secs with spooling turbo at the start.

60-160 was 17 seconds (RPM hit a max of 4,900 ie the car accelerated at peak torque but did not hit the peak BHP at 5,500 rpm)

Ceramic Coating

Ceramic coating is holding well thus far. Couple of days earlier noticed couple of small scratch marks on the bonnet and on rear door. non of those have penetrated to the paint. According to the supplier it is recommended to have a followup on the coating every 2 months but I dont think it needs that stringent upkeep. But planning on doing a checkup every 5-6 months.