Changing The Gearbox From Auto To Manual

[Iroshana]

We are looking to get Toyota CR41 or a CR42 with manual transmission. Found most of them having automatic gear boxes.

Can anybody explain is it possible to change the automatic gearbox to a manual gearbox. What will be the out come? Will it work like the original?

If I get KR41 or KR42 petrol manual vehicle, is it possible to change the engine to a diesel one?

However finally I need a diesel, manual van. What will be the best option?

[miniace]

Most apposite alternative for you to go for a manual diesel one than converting .That will help out saving money and time.

MINIACE

[Nilantha]

  miniace said:

Most apposite alternative for you to go for a manual diesel one than converting .That will help out saving money and time.

MINIACE

100% agreed

[Iroshana]

  miniace said:

Most apposite alternative for you to go for a manual diesel one than converting .That will help out saving money and time.

MINIACE

I was looking for that last couple of months. Found only one and it was also sold when Im going to see the vehicle. It seems original diesel, manual are very rare.

[Nilantha]

  Iroshana said:

I was looking for that last couple of months. Found only one and it was also sold when Im going to see the vehicle. It seems original diesel, manual are very rare.

Then u can buy Diesel Auto and convert to manual.

[Edward]

Hi Friend,

Converting anything from the original condition ( auto to manuel or petrol to Diesal) is not advisable at all. I read an article somtime back, converting auto to manuel is transmission is a complicated thing, & even after that, the gear box will not work as original. My workplace had a van, which was converted from auto to manuel, this van usualy be in the workshop, more than in the road. Once I travelled in that van, & the driver told me the gear box has become a pain.

And think about the second hand value of the converted van. I do not need to tell you about it

Edward

[priya]

  Iroshana said:

We are looking to get Toyota CR41 or a CR42 with manual transmission. Found most of them having automatic gear boxes.

Can anybody explain is it possible to change the automatic gearbox to a manual gearbox. What will be the out come? Will it work like the original?

If I get KR41 or KR42 petrol manual vehicle, is it possible to change the engine to a diesel one?

However finally I need a diesel, manual van. What will be the best option?

We don't usually change a ship's(vessel) engine to run with water when petrol is expensive..instead ...we buy a smaller ship!

Kidding

[ferrarif50]

i think its better to go for a DIESEL AUTO which is not hard to find...

is there a particular reason to get a manual ?

[priya]

  ferrarif50 said:

i think its better to go for a DIESEL AUTO which is not hard to find...

is there a particular reason to get a manual ?

The person may be under perception that Auto's when malfunctioned are very costly to repair and also require hard to find expertise. Luckily it isnt the case as far as I know it comes with a basic automatic and no complication like CVT or multimatic-s.

But if he thinks lack of rapid torque transfer...then yes this can only be achieved in the manual, but yet again if I have not mistaken both manual and auto have same BHP and power to weight. Somebody please correct me if I am wrong. And also a little plus on the consumption not drastic I think.

[ferrarif50]

  priya said:

The person may be under perception that Auto's when malfunctioned are very costly to repair and also require hard to find expertise. Luckily it isnt the case as far as I know it comes with a basic automatic and no complication like CVT or multimatic-s.

yes... this is a common misunderstanding in here SL and the best thing is a recondition auto gearbox is cheaper than a manual gearbox (this is for diesel vans)

also what i think is u only need a manual transmission if u r driving a sports car!

[Iroshana]

  ferrarif50 said:

yes... this is a common misunderstanding in here SL and the best thing is a recondition auto gearbox is cheaper than a manual gearbox (this is for diesel vans)

also what i think is u only need a manual transmission if u r driving a sports car!

I know few of my friends who had Diesel Automatic vans. They never recommend automatic transmission because all of them had bad experience havin automatic. The biggest disadvantage is "Thallu Start" not possible. We never expect it when we buying a vehicle. But there are some occasions we need it. Having a Van is not like a Car. It will run excessively than a car which we use at home. Also I believe manual transmission is more fuel economical. Pls correct me if i'm wrong.

[priya]

  Iroshana said:

I know few of my friends who had Diesel Automatic vans. They never recommend automatic transmission because all of them had bad experience havin automatic. The biggest disadvantage is "Thallu Start" not possible. We never expect it when we buying a vehicle. But there are some occasions we need it. Having a Van is not like a Car. It will run excessively than a car which we use at home. Also I believe manual transmission is more fuel economical. Pls correct me if i'm wrong.

This particular one's you referred, had problems because of bad auto gearbox or other malfunction(eg:electrical fuel pump etc).???.both of these problems as I know can be eliminated via proper maintenance and proactive replacement/repair on time unless its a factory fault! And doing so will eliminate the thallu start situation 95% of time.

One such mandatory tip is to have a Excellent battery in your vehicle if its an auto! This I don't think any person can argue on!

And well, consumption is something totally different! What is the most accurate reason for your opinion on auto been bad?

[ferrarif50]

  Iroshana said:

I know few of my friends who had Diesel Automatic vans. They never recommend automatic transmission because all of them had bad experience havin automatic. The biggest disadvantage is "Thallu Start" not possible. We never expect it when we buying a vehicle. But there are some occasions we need it. Having a Van is not like a Car. It will run excessively than a car which we use at home. Also I believe manual transmission is more fuel economical. Pls correct me if i'm wrong.

Iroshana,

Don't go for an auto because u can't do "tallu start" ! u have to keep the battery,etc. well to avoid "tallu start", so its not fair to put the blame on Auto Gearbox. neh? regarding the fuel consumption, u can get a good mileage from a auto also, if u can use ur right-foot gently...

[priya]

  ferrarif50 said:

u can get a good mileage from a auto also, if u can use ur right-foot gently...

Thats the magic word. Do it and believe me and the results will be astonishing.

[Mean Green z28]

  Edward said:

Hi Friend,

Converting anything from the original condition ( auto to manuel or petrol to Diesal) is not advisable at all. I read an article somtime back, converting auto to manuel is transmission is a complicated thing, & even after that, the gear box will not work as original. My workplace had a van, which was converted from auto to manuel, this van usualy be in the workshop, more than in the road. Once I travelled in that van, & the driver told me the gear box has become a pain.

And think about the second hand value of the converted van. I do not need to tell you about it

Edward

I don't think that's true in most cases. If the swap is done correctly with the right parts, then it's a totally feasible project. I myself have done such conversions (auto>manual, Manual>auto) many times on mine and customers cars and have not had one issue arise from it. It takes a lot of knowledge about what you're doing and how it's going to affect the powertrain. Saying the gearbox would not work as original would mean that the installer didn't do a good job at it and just threw things together or the used transmission that was being installed was a piece of crap to begin with. I know from experience that some mechanics in SL take on jobs larger than their knowledge/abilities and the customer gets screwed in the end since they either didn't get the right part or just didn't know what they were doing. The only issue you may have on a modern car is that the auto transmissions are computer controlled in most cases, and therefore may require a wiring harness/computer that matches the relevant transmission being installed (usually only if you're going from manual to auto).

Edited August 2, 2008 by Mean Green z28

[priya]

  Mean Green z28 said:

I don't think that's true in most cases. If the swap is done correctly with the right parts, then it's a totally feasible project. I myself have done such conversions (auto>manual, Manual>auto) many times on mine and customers cars and have not had one issue arise from it. It takes a lot of knowledge about what you're doing and how it's going to affect the powertrain. Saying the gearbox would not work as original would mean that the installer didn't do a good job at it and just threw things together or the used transmission that was being installed was a piece of crap to begin with. I know from experience that some mechanics in SL take on jobs larger than their knowledge/abilities and the customer gets screwed in the end since they either didn't get the right part or just didn't know what they were doing. The only issue you may have on a modern car is that the auto transmissions are computer controlled in most cases, and therefore may require a wiring harness/computer that matches the relevant transmission being installed (usually only if you're going from manual to auto).

Correct me if I am wrong, but a lot more aspects should be taken into consideration other than Power train and Gearbox if simply it is to be Labeled a "Complete Conversion"..many conversions done here are just the gearbox and engine.

But items like breaks, ecu, diagnostics, fueling, electrics, suspension are excluded. If all these attended too properly..only then will it be a trouble free vehicle.

Coming back to the market value..surely a conversion does not carry the same market value for any vehicle I am quite sure . Thats because originality is expensive and factory made defaults are valued as well as their quality pieces of work done in Japan, but not to forget and underestimate there are a couple of very smart guys here who have done and can do a 1to1 proper conversion!

Also I must confess good things are hard to come by and also not cheap! So are limited..since a good conversion is hard to find...

One example comes to my mind. That one of the few I know..Fellow member here "GihanFX's" STI!

[Ruslan]

Agree with priya. have seen many converted vehicles (Couple of CE100/AE100s and FB15s) with no problem. if the Mech. guy is familiar with the thing, then i think it's not a big issue. if you Converting a gearbox to manual one in CR41/42, then you need to buy Clutch pump, manual gearbox with flywheel, Manual instrument cluster(without those P, D, R letters), ECU (if it's a EFI) gear lever and cables etc..I think best way is to get a diesel auto and transfer it to Manual one.

[Mani]

The conversion can be done but it's complicated to do it properly. I have converted two supras to manual transmission but it was a PITA.

If you decide to go through with the conversion, you will need all the little pieces that is needed for a proper conversion. Major parts are the obvious transmission, ECU, all the clutch links, tubes, cables [depending on how the clutch is actuated]. You will also need a new brake pedal as the auto pedal is usually wider than the one that is on a manual transmission and will not fit with a clutch pedal next to it.

Although, on paper, the conversion looks simple, there is a lot of little parts that you will need to properly do the job.

If you must do this conversion, my recommendation is to find a wrecked van with the manual transmission and take all the parts out of it and transplant it to your vehicle. Expect for a long and costly process though and your resale value may not benefit from it.

If your worry is that your auto trans reliability, keep this in mind. The biggest killer of an auto trans is heat. Especially for vehicles driven in SL as it's a lot of low speed stop and go traffic. The biggest and most cost effective preventative measure you can do to a automatic vehicle is to install a good trans oil cooler. If you keep the oil with in it's proper operating temperature the trans will be just fine and will last you a long time.

Edited August 3, 2008 by Mani

[nuwan dimuthu]

hi all,

i, new to this forum,i think we have to change(replace) the original dash board also when we are converting auto to mannual transmission ,bcoz in the automatic transmission gear indicators(actually current gear position) are in the dash board , so it'l become complicated task , other wise any body can identify this is a converted one ? , correct me if im wrong

[Ruslan]

  nuwan dimuthu said:

hi all,

i, new to this forum,i think we have to change(replace) the original dash board also when we are converting auto to mannual transmission ,bcoz in the automatic transmission gear indicators(actually current gear position) are in the dash board , so it'l become complicated task , other wise any body can identify this is a converted one ? , correct me if im wrong

Welcome to the forum mate!! If you can find a Same car models Manual Instrument cluster then it's easy. recon spare part joints got enough of these, unless the car is very rare model.

Edited August 6, 2008 by Ruslan

[Mean Green z28]

  Mani said:

The conversion can be done but it's complicated to do it properly. I have converted two supras to manual transmission but it was a PITA.

If you decide to go through with the conversion, you will need all the little pieces that is needed for a proper conversion. Major parts are the obvious transmission, ECU, all the clutch links, tubes, cables [depending on how the clutch is actuated]. You will also need a new brake pedal as the auto pedal is usually wider than the one that is on a manual transmission and will not fit with a clutch pedal next to it.

Although, on paper, the conversion looks simple, there is a lot of little parts that you will need to properly do the job.

If you must do this conversion, my recommendation is to find a wrecked van with the manual transmission and take all the parts out of it and transplant it to your vehicle. Expect for a long and costly process though and your resale value may not benefit from it.

That is what i was trying to explain in my post above too but I think my post was misunderstood. There's a LOT to be taken into consideration including the the PCM 'cos the auto/manual programs are different. The manual program holds the rpm's a bit longer during shifts so the rpm's dont drop rapidly while the clutch is down and the guy is shifting while the auto trans. program doesnt' have that feature ('cos there's no disengagement in the torque convertor during shifts) but has all the shift tables and line pressure blah blah blah info. Atleast that's the way it is on the f-bodies.

There's wiring, clutch safety switches for startup/cruise control, pedals, etc. too. If done correctly, it's possible ... if you're not ready to do it right and do it all the way, don't even shake a stick at it!

For example, A simple rundown of my swap from Auto to manual on first my Camaro and just recently on my TransAm is as follows. I may have forgotten some but I've tried to show how involved it is. There's a LOT of measuring, cutting, lining up, assemble, remove, reassemble .. then do it all again... argh!

Had to cut a hole in the floor where the shifter comes through. Needed the boot and console lid from a manual car.

Had to remove the auto pedal assembly and install the manual pedal assembly. and that's a lot of fun 'cos the entire steering column needed to come out 'cos it wrapped around the top of the column.

Had to cut a hole (and two small holes for bolts) in the firewall for the clutch master cylinder.

Needed new clutch and flywheel assembly along with the new transmission

Needed a new cross-member for the trans 'cos the manual trans is longer

Although I didn't do it, the entire engine harness needs to be swapped to a manual harness and even the interior harness needs to be changed if you're going all the way (auto shifter has a multi-selection switch for park/neutral/reverse/gear indications to the PCM/starting system. I creatively (also read, digged into my SL roots ... lol) piggybacked off the harness and ran my own wires to the clutch pedal, reverse lights/cruise control/etc. so I didn't have to rip apart the interior and get everything off a junked car ... lotsa $'s!!!

Had to reflash the PCM with a manual tune with different tables and with updated speedometer reference signals ('cos it works off a reluctor wheel not a cable).

Had to remove all the cooler lines/etc. from the auto tranny to clean it all up. I just plugged the tubes for the cooler lines in the radiator, but if it was the other way, I've have needed a new radiator too with new cooler hard lines/etc.

Thankfully, our cars dont have the shift indication on the dash, so I didn't have to swap that out either.

Going manual is Lot easier than going auto. since the manual trans doesn't need as much electronics to run (just speedo, reverse switch, and shift lockout) What I did with piggy-back wiring can def. not be done and requires atleast the engine harness with the huge transmission connector with like 25 wires going to it. Thankfully, there's some companies that sell kits now with harness branches that can be pinned into the PCM/wiring harness so that you don't have to do the whole harness swap, but that too takes time and patience and it's easier to swap harnesses if you have one lying around. Most people going to auto setups usually aren't going for a stock setup anyways, so everything is custom and the trans is usually a manual shift valvebody setup so there's no computer control on them either, so it's just bolt up and go!

Edited August 7, 2008 by Mean Green z28