Suzuki baleno

trish_auto · December 22, 2017

1 hour ago, iRage said:

I believe they were working on the 1.0L turbo...who knows...I guess it is a matter of priorities. I think most are starting use Lithium Ion batteries..fourth gen of Toyota/Lexus HSD is supposed to be powered with Li-Ion batteries isn't it ?

True, compared to other brands their top end hybrids are having an edge in the car market. Suzuki is opposite to that. According to recent trends in Suzuki, they must be researching more on three pod engines with improved efficiency and power. First time in their history they have coupled the turbo charged engine with the mild hybrid option in Suzuki Xbee. They are claiming their turbo charged 1.0 L engine is as powerful as regular 1.5 L version. Several other top brands have also shown up their 1.0 L three pod powered cars recently. Is there a competitive saving on the taxes with three pods in Japan ?

iRage · December 22, 2017

Hmmm...if I remember correct it still falls in to a 300 series plate. So the taxes should be the same for up to 1600cc..or so. I don't know for sure...never looked in to it.

With a Hybrid on the other hand...I pay nearly 45000yen per year on road taxes for the 1600cc Corolla wagon. My father in law pays like a few thousand for his Aqua

So if you really want to save on road taxes in Japan you get a kei car or a small Hybrid

trish_auto · December 23, 2017

16 hours ago, iRage said:

I believe they were working on the 1.0L turbo...who knows...I guess it is a matter of priorities. I think most are starting use Lithium Ion batteries..fourth gen of Toyota/Lexus HSD is supposed to be powered with Li-Ion batteries isn't it ?

Toyota already has 1.0L turbo variant ;

http://toyota.jp/tank/performance/?padid=ag341_from_tank_top_performance

iRage · December 23, 2017

2 hours ago, trish_auto said:

Toyota already has 1.0L turbo variant ;

http://toyota.jp/tank/performance/?padid=ag341_from_tank_top_performance

Oh right...forgot about the Rumi/Tank family. It was first introduced with the 1KR-FE and then later with the 1KR-VET. The entire 1KR line up is actually developed by Daihatsu (including the -VET). Actually, most, if not all, of Toyota's small engines are Daihatsu engines. I think Subaru uses the same engine for the new Justy ?

trish_auto · December 23, 2017

3 hours ago, iRage said:

Oh right...forgot about the Rumi/Tank family. It was first introduced with the 1KR-FE and then later with the 1KR-VET. The entire 1KR line up is actually developed by Daihatsu (including the -VET). Actually, most, if not all, of Toyota's small engines are Daihatsu engines. I think Subaru uses the same engine for the new Justy ?

afik Daihatsu is fully owned by the Toyota. As a brand it is very popular in Japan and always among the top rankings in their small cars. What makes it so special for Daihatsu to contend with top auto brands ? Price / Quality/ Customer care ?

Long time back there was a trend for Daihatsu Charades in Sri Lanka. But not now.

Comparing Toyota Tank and Daihatsu Thor, found to be almost similar in their specs. Bit confusing why two identical models come with different brandings .

Edited December 23, 2017 by trish_auto

Magnum · December 23, 2017

On 21/12/2017 at 10:29 PM, iRage said:

....like I said...a kei car's torque delivery is quite different from a larger engine car and you really don't need to rev it that much to accelerate it like you say you need to. Peak torque is delivered way down in the rev range so from a stand still (like in a traffic jam) the kei cars actually do quite well. The issue with the kei engines is that there isn't much usable torque in the mid and upper ranges. True...you won't get anywhere close to the 0-50 kmph or 0-100kmph acceleration times of a larger engine car unless you step on it like you are choking the life out of a water buffalo however, acceleration to more modest "city" limits are pretty good without having to break a sweat. So the short quick accelerations are not as bad as you seem to make it out to be. Its the long fast ones that suck (other things that suck..climbing hills ! and having people who are larger than the average Japanese person oh..and luggage larger than 3.5 grocery bags).

Having owned a Suzuki Every I can second this. It's pretty nimble around city limits

iRage · December 23, 2017

4 hours ago, trish_auto said:

afik Daihatsu is fully owned by the Toyota. As a brand it is very popular in Japan and always among the top rankings in their small cars. What makes it so special for Daihatsu to contend with top auto brands ? Price / Quality/ Customer care ?

Long time back there was a trend for Daihatsu Charades in Sri Lanka. But not now.

Comparing Toyota Tank and Daihatsu Thor, found to be almost similar in their specs. Bit confusing why two identical models come with different brandings .

Yes Toyota is Daihatsu's prinicipal owner.

As to why Daihatsu is popular over another kei car is the same as why is Toyota popular over Honda and that more popular over Subaru, etc...it is a mixture of a lot of things.

Daihatsu kei cars are quite popular in Japan mainly because they offer quite a variety compared to most other brands.Also in a way people see a Toyota when they see a Daihatsu (when they check out a Daihatsu model the chances are they had gone and checked out the equivalent Toyota as well).

Where customer care is concerned, the major manufacturers in Japan are pretty equal. Price wise I believe the Daihatsus are a bit more expensive than the others. Also, the Daihatsu range has a bit more refinement when compared to Suzuki and Mitsubishi. The closest that comes to Daihatsu refinement (and at times even exceeds it) are honda kei cars and the Hondas have been giving Daihatsu cars a good run for their money. Also, Daihatsu gets an edge through the Toyota tie up.They do use Toyota's distribution chains. For example you can go to a Toyota Parts depot and find Daihatsu parts as well.

Daihatsu's large cars have been Toyota cars, they've had everything from the Corolla, Camry to the Town Ace rebadged as Daihatsu.

The Thor (which is the original) is sold as the Tank/Rumi by Toyota and Justy by Suzuki. For starters, this way they can sell more of the same car by reaching out to market areas a particular brand might not have a strong presence in. Secondly, it is a way to position the car to meet different market segments. For example Subaru appeals to a particular group of people different to those whose first instinct is to run to Toyota and/or Daihatsu...so by giving the car to Subaru they are able to sell a sportier version to a group of people whose first and second visit may not be a Toyota or Daihatsu dealership. Thirdly, it is also about R&D and production costs for all three manufacturers.

dilshant80 · January 3, 2018

On 12/22/2017 at 6:07 AM, iRage said:

Any idea why no one wants to bring down Honda kei cars...they are a lot better in refinement when it comes to interior and is a bit more fun than the Suzukis and the Daihatsus...

You don't find the Honda's in demand because the kei car nbox price is the same as a Baleno, so the price is too high

iRage · January 3, 2018

18 minutes ago, dilshant80 said:

You don't find the Honda's in demand because the kei car nbox price is the same as a Baleno, so the price is too high

Yes..but it is a much much nicer car. Also, since it is not Hybrid I guess the taxes will be higher than that for the Wagon R.

dilshant80 · January 3, 2018

32 minutes ago, iRage said:

Yes..but it is a much much nicer car. Also, since it is not Hybrid I guess the taxes will be higher than that for the Wagon R.

Agreed. The interior quality of the Honda is much better than the Toyota, Daihatsu, Suzuki kei counterparts. However, for the price of the nbox or baleno, its actually better to go for a Daihatsu Thor/Toyota Tank which offers MPV features.

trish_auto · January 3, 2018

Kei is a kei, you don't get the same performance, finishing and comfort that of standard sedan, hatch car. All the kei models comes with a higher fuel economy figures and lower price at the expense of lower performance, comfort and safety. All the car manufactures are very good at maintaining the class difference in all these aspects. But recent developments in kei models are much improved compared to 5-6 yrs ago. What I don't like is , most of these kei models fail to offer reasonable comfort at rear passengers. Depth of seats are very low and painful in a long journey. This is the reason why they offer better refinement in their higher level models such as Suziki : Bandit, Solio, XBee., Toyota : Tank., Daihatsu : Thor.

Good thing of ene-charge technology kei cars are they offer better pickup than non-mild hybrid kei cars. Now most of these kei engines are further improved with turbo charges too. According to present tax brackets, best small car option would be a 1.0 L engine with turbo+mild hybrid facilities.