Budget Barge: Bluebird SU12 or Camry CV30

Jigawatts · February 7, 2021

Hi Guys,

Continuing my car hunt for a non ridiculously priced car. I'm looking for a car that is relatively comfy around 1.2-1.4 Mill. There are early 90s Diesel Barges for this budget. Nissan Bluebird U12 and Camry/Vista CV30. 64- plates. Have a couple of questions for the experts here.

1. What would be the better choice between Bluebird and Camry/Vista? Parts wise? Engine reliability? Easy to live with? Performance?

2. SU12 Bluebirds are almost same price or more expensive as CV30 Camry's...given that Toyota's are more expensive usually is there a specific reason for this?

3. How reliable are these old diesels(Bluebird has the vanette LD engine and Camry has 2C )? Can a one time engine overhaul sort things out for a reasonable time? How would these engines fare at emissions test?

I don't have a specific reason for buying diesel but prices seem relatively ok and you can't find petrol variants of these cars easily.

Any other suggestions are welcome.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Jigawatts

PreseaLover · February 8, 2021

13 hours ago, Jigawatts said:

Hi Guys,

Continuing my car hunt for a non ridiculously priced car. I'm looking for a car that is relatively comfy around 1.2-1.4 Mill. There are early 90s Diesel Barges for this budget. Nissan Bluebird U12 and Camry/Vista CV30. 64- plates. Have a couple of questions for the experts here.

1. What would be the better choice between Bluebird and Camry/Vista? Parts wise? Engine reliability? Easy to live with? Performance?

2. SU12 Bluebirds are almost same price or more expensive as CV30 Camry's...given that Toyota's are more expensive usually is there a specific reason for this?

3. How reliable are these old diesels(Bluebird has the vanette LD engine and Camry has 2C )? Can a one time engine overhaul sort things out for a reasonable time? How would these engines fare at emissions test?

I don't have a specific reason for buying diesel but prices seem relatively ok and you can't find petrol variants of these cars easily.

Any other suggestions are welcome.

Its funny I'm looking for the same 2 cars as you these days but I'm looking for for the SU13 and SV40 though, and I',m looking for the Petrol ones because I cant stand the noise of Diesels, and diesel engines are not that good compared to petrol's. Specially given that these cars are almost more than 25 years old.

Edited February 8, 2021 by PreseaLover

iRage · February 8, 2021

1. Both are the same....reliability is totally dependant on how the car has been taken care of over the last 25-30 years. Technically the Bluebird was intended to compete with the likes of the Corona/Carina...and the narrow body Camry was a segment higher than that....but the lines are very blurred. The Camry is slightly more comfortable (IMO) with plusher seats but the Bluebird is far more interesting to drive. Being 25+ year old diesels..both will have usual issues of vibration and sound because the sound and vibration deadening would have worn out by now.

Both cars will have plenty of mechanical parts around but body parts are going to be hard to find (and we are talking abotu a lot harder than cars like old SUnny, Corolla, Carina)

2. No idea....

3. Reliability is dependant upon how well the engine have been taken care of. 25-30 years we talking about engines that would have done about 250,000km. Probably has had an overhaul or two as well. If the work done before has been good then the engine will be fairly okay (these are workhorse engines)..but then you also have to look in to other compnents like the electricals...Usually an old petrol engine is a bit easier to take care of than an old diesel. Is there any specific reason you want a diesel ? If you are buying it because diesel is cheaper....it won't be...when you take the total cost of ownership both a petrol and diesel will be more or less the same (whatever money you save on fuel will be spent on slightly higer maintenance requirements). For it to make any difference..you will need to travel a lot or do some heavy work with it.

Jigawatts · February 8, 2021

9 hours ago, PreseaLover said:

Its funny I'm looking for the same 2 cars as you these days but I'm looking for for the SU13 and SV40 though, and I',m looking for the Petrol ones because I cant stand the noise of Diesels, and diesel engines are not that good compared to petrol's. Specially given that these cars are almost more than 25 years old.

7 hours ago, iRage said:

1. Both are the same....reliability is totally dependant on how the car has been taken care of over the last 25-30 years. Technically the Bluebird was intended to compete with the likes of the Corona/Carina...and the narrow body Camry was a segment higher than that....but the lines are very blurred. The Camry is slightly more comfortable (IMO) with plusher seats but the Bluebird is far more interesting to drive. Being 25+ year old diesels..both will have usual issues of vibration and sound because the sound and vibration deadening would have worn out by now.

Both cars will have plenty of mechanical parts around but body parts are going to be hard to find (and we are talking abotu a lot harder than cars like old SUnny, Corolla, Carina)

2. No idea....

3. Reliability is dependant upon how well the engine have been taken care of. 25-30 years we talking about engines that would have done about 250,000km. Probably has had an overhaul or two as well. If the work done before has been good then the engine will be fairly okay (these are workhorse engines)..but then you also have to look in to other compnents like the electricals...Usually an old petrol engine is a bit easier to take care of than an old diesel. Is there any specific reason you want a diesel ? If you are buying it because diesel is cheaper....it won't be...when you take the total cost of ownership both a petrol and diesel will be more or less the same (whatever money you save on fuel will be spent on slightly higer maintenance requirements). For it to make any difference..you will need to travel a lot or do some heavy work with it.

Thanks guys for the inputs. I don't have a specific need for diesel but it seems when it comes to larger 90s cars people preferred diesel so 90 percent of these cars are diesel ... It's almost impossible to find a petrol U12 or a Camry and there are no Petrol Vistas at all from the V30 range. Heck even the AT170 Carina's also are mostly diesel 64- ones .

If I can find a petrol I'd definitely go for it but seems it's gonna be a long wait. I don't care at all about fuel economy.

iRage · February 8, 2021

1 hour ago, Jigawatts said:

Thanks guys for the inputs. I don't have a specific need for diesel but it seems when it comes to larger 90s cars people preferred diesel so 90 percent of these cars are diesel ... It's almost impossible to find a petrol U12 or a Camry and there are no Petrol Vistas at all from the V30 range. Heck even the AT170 Carina's also are mostly diesel 64- ones .

If I can find a petrol I'd definitely go for it but seems it's gonna be a long wait. I don't care at all about fuel economy.

Well....for starters it was the permits...then it was the whole engine size to body weight thingy...apparently this guy who set the laws of physics has made it such that for a large vehicle with added weight to move at decent pace it requires more power. At the time this meant larger engines and also at the time large diesel engines were more economical than their petrol counterpart (the higher low end torque made it easier to drive around town as well). Add to that the fact that the permits at the time had a engine capacity of 1500-1800cc for petrols and 2000cc-2200cc? for diesels...people went for the diesels for better value for money (I think there was a capand you had to pay some other duty for anything in excess of that).

To be honest...a 1.8L V40 was not the most zippiest car around...it had like 120hp but it was quite lethargic (low on torque and weighed a good 1200kg or something close). The diesel had less power (100hp or something ?) but had oodles of torque. A friend of mine had a hardtop petrol V40 and another a V30 Camry diesel. The diesel would smoke the petrol one off the mark everytime....but it did run out of puff at about 100kmph

So yeah...almost all large cars you would find from back them would be diesel

Magnum · February 9, 2021

On 2/7/2021 at 10:22 PM, Jigawatts said:

Hi Guys,

Continuing my car hunt for a non ridiculously priced car. I'm looking for a car that is relatively comfy around 1.2-1.4 Mill. There are early 90s Diesel Barges for this budget. Nissan Bluebird U12 and Camry/Vista CV30. 64- plates. Have a couple of questions for the experts here.

1. What would be the better choice between Bluebird and Camry/Vista? Parts wise? Engine reliability? Easy to live with? Performance?

2. SU12 Bluebirds are almost same price or more expensive as CV30 Camry's...given that Toyota's are more expensive usually is there a specific reason for this?

3. How reliable are these old diesels(Bluebird has the vanette LD engine and Camry has 2C )? Can a one time engine overhaul sort things out for a reasonable time? How would these engines fare at emissions test?

I don't have a specific reason for buying diesel but prices seem relatively ok and you can't find petrol variants of these cars easily.

Any other suggestions are welcome.

V30 Vista is a beautiful car, but I haven't seen one in a very long time, they seem to be some what rare. Parts are bit hard to come by including mechanical parts. Last time when I went looking for CV30 parts, some spare parts shops didnt even know the model.

On 2/8/2021 at 11:55 AM, PreseaLover said:

Its funny I'm looking for the same 2 cars as you these days but I'm looking for for the SU13 and SV40 though, and I',m looking for the Petrol ones because I cant stand the noise of Diesels, and diesel engines are not that good compared to petrol's. Specially given that these cars are almost more than 25 years old.

Petrol is either EU13(SR18) or HU13(SR20) and diesel is SU13(CD20)

18 hours ago, iRage said:

Well....for starters it was the permits...then it was the whole engine size to body weight thingy...apparently this guy who set the laws of physics has made it such that for a large vehicle with added weight to move at decent pace it requires more power. At the time this meant larger engines and also at the time large diesel engines were more economical than their petrol counterpart (the higher low end torque made it easier to drive around town as well). Add to that the fact that the permits at the time had a engine capacity of 1500-1800cc for petrols and 2000cc-2200cc? for diesels...people went for the diesels for better value for money (I think there was a capand you had to pay some other duty for anything in excess of that).

To be honest...a 1.8L V40 was not the most zippiest car around...it had like 120hp but it was quite lethargic (low on torque and weighed a good 1200kg or something close). The diesel had less power (100hp or something ?) but had oodles of torque. A friend of mine had a hardtop petrol V40 and another a V30 Camry diesel. The diesel would smoke the petrol one off the mark everytime....but it did run out of puff at about 100kmph

So yeah...almost all large cars you would find from back them would be diesel

The CV30 Camry is diesel intercooler turbo, 2C intercooler turbo to be specific. Have driven one and can confirm its pretty quick. A small light on the instrument cluster comes on when the turbo kicks in

Edited February 9, 2021 by Magnum

iRage · February 9, 2021

3 hours ago, Magnum said:

The CV30 Camry is diesel intercooler turbo, 2C intercooler turbo to be specific. Have driven one and can confirm its pretty quick. A small light on the instrument cluster comes on when the turbo kicks in

Yes..it is pretty quick...It chocked at about 100-110ish and got sluggish to move faster than that...but it would get you from 0 to 100-110 pretty fast

PreseaLover · February 9, 2021

8 hours ago, Magnum said:

V30 Vista is a beautiful car, but I haven't seen one in a very long time, they seem to be some what rare. Parts are bit hard to come by including mechanical parts. Last time when I went looking for CV30 parts, some spare parts shops didnt even know the model.

Petrol is either EU13(SR18) or HU13(SR20) and diesel is SU13(CD20)

The CV30 Camry is diesel intercooler turbo, 2C intercooler turbo to be specific. Have driven one and can confirm its pretty quick. A small light on the instrument cluster comes on when the turbo kicks in

ahh thanks for that explanation. Didnt know the difference between EU and SU