Engine Oil Level Reduces And White Smoke After Overhaul

buddhi · May 20, 2014

I have done a overhaul to my KE72 engine around 5 months ago through a reputed company. All the engine related work done by Edirisinghe Brothers. After that I have drove only 3500 km up to now.

Now I experience,

- Oil level reduces

- White smoke in high RPM

I have informed to the company where the repair has done. As I expected they are complaining about the spares I used (I bough 90% of the parts from MM Organization) they say they might have given me duplicates.

Please share your ideas with me.

GayanR · May 20, 2014

according to their site

We do not deal in duplicate parts or low quality parts. hence, we offer you a written money back guarantee on all the products we sell. If you are not satisfied with any product before installation, you have the option of returning and obtaining a refund within 14 days of purchase. If any product found to be defective after installation within the guarantee period, a replacement of such part is guaranteed

have you tired claiming money back...

buddhi · May 20, 2014

@Gayan...

I have installed the part and used for 3500 km by now. So this will not apply for that now. And I called them they claim that their parts are genuine. And they are passing the ball to the repair guys.

GayanR · May 20, 2014

I'm sorry for what you are going through...if you are experiencing white smoke can be a head gasket leak....but if you are burning oil smoke should look more like blue...have you checked under your car or where you park the car for any oil leaks....does your air filter wet from oil.....may be the white smoke masking the blue smoke...either way most probably you got a leaky head gasket or a seal leak...first check your air filter and housing for any oil...

Rumesh88 · May 21, 2014

Do you know what your overhaul entailed? A typical overhaul involves, grinding and seating of valves, replacing valve seals, replacing valve springs, facing the head, replacing the gasket, re-boring the engine block, replacing piston rings, replacing main bearing and piston bearings (big end), replacing valve cover and sump gasket etc., While some of these are mandatory others can be skipped and also there can be additional things like crank shaft grinding, replacing cam shaft etc all depending on the engine condition.

In your case it is very difficult to argue if the fault was due to an issue with the workmanship or due to a quality issue unless the engine is opened to check for the root cause. However, try to identify if oil is leaking into the combustion chamber through valve seals or through the piston rings and also if the problem is with one or multiple cylinders (a quick look at the spark plugs is enough for this). Usually if the leak is through valve seals you would get more smoke when you keep the engine idling for sometime and then try to pick up (for example at a traffic light) than when you are going at high speed.(Then there is another test to do with a compression tester to determine if it is due to rings or bore). If it is valve seals they can be replaced without much cost and trouble. But if is the rings then of course you are in bit of a trouble. This is my 2 cents.

bagUrE · May 21, 2014

Rumesh,

Nice explanation. BTW, can you elaborate on this a bit more?

On 5/21/2014 at 5:24 AM, Rumesh88 said:
.. if the leak is through valve seals you would get more smoke when you keep the engine idling for sometime and then try to pick up (for example at a traffic light) than when you are going at high speed...

Rumesh88 · May 21, 2014

On 5/21/2014 at 6:14 AM, bagUrE said:
Rumesh,
Nice explanation. BTW, can you elaborate on this a bit more?

When there is an oil leak through the valve stem seals, oil is sucked into the engine when the engine is at low revs and accumulate inside the cylinder (due to high vacuum and longer time window). Then as you accelerate the accumulated oil is burnt giving out lot of smoke. Some oil is still sucked into the cylinder when you are at high speed too but the amount is less because of shorter time window and less vacuum. On the other hand if oil is thrown into the cylinder through rings, you get less oil during idle phase and more during high revs. More often than not, in petrol vehicles the issue begins with the valve seals not the rings.

bagUrE · May 21, 2014

Thanks. So in which case the oil consumption is higher?

Rumesh88 · May 21, 2014

On 5/21/2014 at 7:23 AM, bagUrE said:
Thanks. So in which case the oil consumption is higher?

That of course depend on how serious the leak on the valve seal is or how badly the rings/bore is worn out. So it is not possible to compare the two.

buddhi · May 21, 2014

Thank you for all who replied

My Overhaul involved,

- Valve Seat Cutting

- Head Facing

- Replacing the gasket

- Re-boring the engine block

- Replacing piston rings

- Replacing pistons

- Replacing main bearing and piston bearings (big end)

- Replacing sump gasket

- Crank shaft grinding

I too feel oil is leaking into the combustion chamber through valve oil seals, because oil color is not turning into black even after 3000kms.

Can I check such leaks by looking at Spark Plugs ?

I do see more smoke in high RPMs (when speeding around 100kmph)

buddhi · May 21, 2014

I do park my car on a cement floor, I can not see any oli prints of the floor and no sign of leak on the engine body either.

NRX · May 21, 2014

Rumesh. If the engine has an valve seal oil leak a lot of blue smoke should usually be visible after being parked for some days right ?

Rumesh88 · May 21, 2014

On 5/21/2014 at 9:59 AM, buddhi said:
Thank you for all who replied
My Overhaul involved,

- Valve Seat Cutting

- Head Facing

- Replacing the gasket

- Re-boring the engine block

- Replacing piston rings

- Replacing pistons

- Replacing main bearing and piston bearings (big end)

- Replacing sump gasket

- Crank shaft grinding

I too feel oil is leaking into the combustion chamber through valve oil seals, because oil color is not turning into black even after 3000kms.

Can I check such leaks by looking at Spark Plugs ?

I do see more smoke in high RPMs (when speeding around 100kmph)

That's a comprehensive overhaul covering almost everything. If you inspect all four plugs you can identify the ones which burn oil more but that alone is not enough to determine whether the fault is due to leaky oil seals. Still inspecting them would not cost you much. But a better way is to do a compression test. Then select the cylinder with the lowest reading and do a wet compression test (by pouring a few ml of oil on to the piston crown). If the compression improves by more than 30% or so you have a problem with rings, if the improvement is insignificant then the problem is with the seals.

On 5/21/2014 at 10:34 AM, NRX said:
Rumesh. If the engine has an valve seal oil leak a lot of blue smoke should usually be visible after being parked for some days right ?

Well that's another sign but not necessarily in every case. But if it happens definitely there is an oil seal problem.

buddhi · June 18, 2014

Thank you Ramesh,

Where I can get done these two compression test ?

Rumesh88 · June 18, 2014

On 6/18/2014 at 3:33 AM, buddhi said:
Thank you Ramesh,
Where I can get done these two compression test ?

You can get it done from any mech who has a hand-held compression tester. All what they do is remove the plugs, fix the tester to each plug hole in turn and rev the engine for a similar number of revolutions per each cylinder (better to keep the plugs on the plug wires with their body in touch with ground to dissipate ignition HT).

If you are located South of Colombo I would be able to give a contact in Moratuwa.

Ruchira88 · April 7, 2017

On 6/18/2014 at 5:29 AM, Rumesh88 said:

You can get it done from any mech who has a hand-held compression tester. All what they do is remove the plugs, fix the tester to each plug hole in turn and rev the engine for a similar number of revolutions per each cylinder (better to keep the plugs on the plug wires with their body in touch with ground to dissipate ignition HT).

If you are located South of Colombo I would be able to give a contact in Moratuwa.

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Hi rumesh i live in moratuws and i need to do a compression test . Where i should go

Thanks

Twin Turbo · April 8, 2017

On 5/20/2014 at 10:54 AM, buddhi said:

@Gayan...

I have installed the part and used for 3500 km by now. So this will not apply for that now. And I called them they claim that their parts are genuine. And they are passing the ball to the repair guys.

Expand

Did you do a speed test just on your wsay home from the reparer?? did you seaon the engine? what oil is in the engine now?

Your list of parts dosn't include a timing chain - just an observation,, not related to your oil burning.

Edited April 8, 2017 by Twin Turbo

Rumesh88 · April 8, 2017

On 4/7/2017 at 1:57 PM, Ruchira88 said:

Hi rumesh i live in moratuws and i need to do a compression test . Where i should go

Thanks

Expand

Replied your PM.

ajm · April 8, 2017

Hi Friends, I have a similar problem,but it's a diesel.

Engine: Passat Tdi year 2000

some months after the overhaul,there is oil in the intake pipes. Consumption is about 1 litre /1000km s. There is a breather valve in the tappet cover to release crankcase pressure,and it has a hose going to the intake side. The hose mear the turbo is where the oil accumulates,and some drops on the floor if parked overnight. For some time,this connection to intake was removed,and the oil in intake disappeared(no drops in garage floor, but consumption issue still there). So we suspected a problem with the tappet cover valve not isolating the oil vapor from crankcase properly. put a new tappet valve and connected the hose back to intake,no improvement (same amount of oil in intake pipes again) i dont see any excessive white or blue smoke, but occasional black smoke at accelaration (being a diesel,maybe the white smoke is not visible because of black smoke) .

will the oil consumption get worse if not treated?

Oil catch tanks used in motorsport can help with the oil in intake pipe issue on short term?

What about oil additives that claim to stop leaks?

any opinion how to trouble shoot for a permanent fix,valve seals or piston rings or turbo seals?

Edited April 8, 2017 by ajm

Twin Turbo · April 9, 2017

who did the o/h on your engine?

Edited April 9, 2017 by Twin Turbo

ajm · April 9, 2017

a reputed mechanic in Galle,block sleeves by ESinghe and parts from Dars@na Motors Pchikawatte.I think it's too late to point fingers now,rather trying to find the issue.

Edited April 9, 2017 by ajm

Ruchira88 · April 9, 2017

On 4/9/2017 at 2:07 AM, Twin Turbo said:

who did the o/h on your engine?

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Hi mchg

Going to do that after auwrudu

ajm · April 10, 2017

@Rumesh88 your method of low idle,high rpm smoke difference is also valid for Diesel, what about Turbo seal problems?

Rumesh88 · April 10, 2017

On 4/10/2017 at 7:25 AM, ajm said:

@Rumesh88 your method of low idle,high rpm smoke difference is also valid for Diesel, what about Turbo seal problems?

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It should equally apply for a diesel engine too. But you say is that oil accumulates near the turbo. Is it near the oil return line from Turbo? Oil on the return line gets really hot and is likely to leak from the connector on top of the turbo (location according to a picture of your engine on the web) if there is a slight opening or a crack. If you wash the area you should be able to trace where the leak is.

ajm · April 10, 2017

On 4/10/2017 at 2:10 PM, Rumesh88 said:

But you say is that oil accumulates near the turbo. Is it near the oil return line from Turbo?

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sorry for not clear description. The oil vapors in the blowby gasses coming from tappet cover hose accumulates in the intake air pipe of the turbo inlet,because it's the lowest point in the system. At the moment it's not clear why there is so much oil vapor in the blowby gases and where its coming from,valve seals or piston rings. The oil seperator valve in the tappet cover was replaced,but still problem exists.

Rumesh88 · April 11, 2017

On 4/10/2017 at 3:08 PM, ajm said:

sorry for not clear description. The oil vapors in the blowby gasses coming from tappet cover hose accumulates in the intake air pipe of the turbo inlet,because it's the lowest point in the system. At the moment it's not clear why there is so much oil vapor in the blowby gases and where its coming from,valve seals or piston rings. The oil seperator valve in the tappet cover was replaced,but still problem exists.

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Ok I understand. BTW do you have a oil cooler? If so is it properly connected and working?