Toyota townace 1993 engine heat problem

[nuwan26]

friends,

toyota townace (1993) van ekak thiyenawa..kalin A/C wada kare na. eka nisa A/C eka upgrade kara..  kalin thibune engine radiator eka issaraha ekatama set karapu condenser ekak.but eka remove karala aluthen vehicle eka yatin tikak loku condenser ekak set kara workshop eken.fan dekak thiyena tikak loku ekak..dan A/C hodata thiyenawa. but dan thiyena aula heat eka wadi wenawane...mama images attach kara aluth condensor eka, and heat levels..a/c eke normally heat eka 50% wage. a/c dammama wadi wenawa.

mama mark karapu heat levels normalda? engine ekata hoda nadda? a/c workshop ekennam kiwwa radiator eka clean karanna kiyala..thermostat balanna kiyala...oyala mokada hithanne?solution ekak thiyada?nathnam aluth condenser eka van ekata match wenne nadda?

 

radiator eke coolant or engine oil adu wenneth na..aluthenma damma okkoma..habai lagadi dawasaka coolant extra tank eke thibuna coolant okkoma empty wela thibuna.but radiator eke coolant full thibuna.

 

[nuwan26]

[harshansenadhir]

No this is not normal. Since the condenser is fixed underneath the engine, emitting heat from the condenser does not contribute towards this. looks like the additional payload from the A/C contributes to excessive heating of the engine.

can you answer following questions 

1. With A/C switched off, how long does it take for temperature gauge to climb up to 50% mark. is it within 5 minutes or half an hour?

2. You said the gauge goes beyond 50% with A/C on. Is it when the vehicle stuck in traffic or when keep moving? 

3. What's the mileage of the vehicle and when the engine was last re-built ?

4. Did it have this losing of coolant (and of course heating issue) from the expansion tank (Bottle as we call it) even prior to upgrading of A/C

i tend to suspect a blocked thermostat but will wait for your responses. 

 

P.S- Also check the direction of the air flow of the condenser fans whether it blows air out or sucks air in. 

Edited May 2, 2018 by harshansenadhir

[nuwan26]

48 minutes ago, harshansenadhir said:

No this is not normal. Since the condenser is fixed underneath the engine, emitting heat from the condenser does not contribute towards this. looks like the additional payload from the A/C contributes to excessive heating of the engine.

can you answer following questions 

1. With A/C switched off, how long does it take for temperature gauge to climb up to 50% mark. is it within 5 minutes or half an hour?

2. You said the gauge goes beyond 50% with A/C on. Is it when the vehicle stuck in traffic or when keep moving? 

3. What's the mileage of the vehicle and when the engine was last re-built ?

4. Did it have this losing of coolant (and of course heating issue) from the expansion tank (Bottle as we call it) even prior to upgrading of A/C

i tend to suspect a blocked thermostat but will wait for your responses. 

 

P.S- Also check the direction of the air flow of the condenser fans whether it blows air out or sucks air in. 

Hello harsha,

Thank you very much for your fast response.

1-it's normally taking sometime..not too fast..increasing slowly.it's taking normally half an hour i think.

2-heat eka mark karapu levels wala nawathinawa.highway eketh same.mark karapu levels walata  wada increase wenne na..but traffic eke heat eka increase  wenawa.a/c high level ekedi traffic eke yanna ba...red line eka lagatama enawa..A/C off karama adu wenawa ayemath normal level ekata( 50%. as marked on image)

3- mileage 199000  2 months wage mama aragena..engine repair karenam na..but oil gahana prashna ehema na..garage deka thunakinma kiwwa engine eke aulak na kiyala..

4-coolant ekama eka dawasai adu une bottle eke  sathi dekakata wage kalin...radiator eke adu une na..ayemath bottle eka fill kara tikak...but ayemath adu une na.

condenser eken air flow eka yatata ewanne.ground ekata...condenser eka yatin atha thiwwama air flow ekak enawa danenawa hodatama..and condenser fan dekama wada karanawa hodata..

 

 

[nuwan26]

aluth condenser eka hinda radiator ekata ena air flow eka block wela kiyala matanam hithenne..

[nuwan26]

oooh.kiyanna amathaka una..rainy day wala heat eka adu..hodata wahina welawata a/c eka full dammath engine heat eka 50% wage thiyenne..normal day wala wage wadi wenne na..

[nuwan26]

bump...

[Davy]

On 02/05/2018 at 7:04 PM, nuwan26 said:

aluth condenser eka hinda radiator ekata ena air flow eka block wela kiyala matanam hithenne..

This is exactly what I think it is. The airflow of the AC condenser fan is probably restricting airflow through the radiator core. Before you had the AC condenser in front of the radiator, it would have been easier for the radiator fan to draw air from the front of the vehicle. Now, when the AC is on, the fan on top the AC condenser is probably sucking in all the air and creating a sort of void between the condenser and the radiator. As a result, the radiator fan has no fresh air to pull through the radiator.

I think you should think about placing the AC condenser parallel to the radiator. It looks like there is sufficient space in front of the radiator (given that the factory condenser would have been there). This way, the AC would also work more efficiently, because it doesn't have to rely on the fan to cool the condenser. The outside airflow would help as well.

[Twin Turbo]

Check radiator cooling fan.  the fan-clutch may need replacing.

Has the original factory fitted condensor been removed?

The thermostat valve is at the lower rad hose.+ Check the radiator cap.

TT.

Edited May 7, 2018 by Twin Turbo

[nuwan26]

On 5/7/2018 at 9:25 AM, Davy said:

This is exactly what I think it is. The airflow of the AC condenser fan is probably restricting airflow through the radiator core. Before you had the AC condenser in front of the radiator, it would have been easier for the radiator fan to draw air from the front of the vehicle. Now, when the AC is on, the fan on top the AC condenser is probably sucking in all the air and creating a sort of void between the condenser and the radiator. As a result, the radiator fan has no fresh air to pull through the radiator.

I think you should think about placing the AC condenser parallel to the radiator. It looks like there is sufficient space in front of the radiator (given that the factory condenser would have been there). This way, the AC would also work more efficiently, because it doesn't have to rely on the fan to cool the condenser. The outside airflow would help as well.

Hi,

Thank you very much for reply.

actually there is no space to fit this condenser in front of the radiator.factory fitted radiator  is small than this.(thin)

if the reason is blocked airflow..is there any way to increase radiator cooling speed...like speeding up fan, to do something with valve and increase coolant flow or something like that?

[nuwan26]

21 hours ago, Twin Turbo said:

Check radiator cooling fan.  the fan-clutch may need replacing.

Has the original factory fitted condensor been removed?

The thermostat valve is at the lower rad hose.+ Check the radiator cap.

TT.

Hi,Thank you very much reply.

i think this one don't have clutch system because it's running once engine starts.it's not starts after engine heats.

yeah.original one removed and fitted new condenser at bottom.

yeah i'm going to replace cap and if it's not working i will check thermostat valve too.

[nuwan26]

the guy who fitted this condenser told me to clean radiator..what's thats mean? cleaning surface or cleaning inside?(like flushing)

[Davy]

38 minutes ago, nuwan26 said:

Hi,

Thank you very much for reply.

actually there is no space to fit this condenser in front of the radiator.factory fitted radiator  is small than this.(thin)

if the reason is blocked airflow..is there any way to increase radiator cooling speed...like speeding up fan, to do something with valve and increase coolant flow or something like that?

If I were you, i'd look into the possibility of getting it sorted out the correct way by installing the condenser and the radiator parallel to each other like it came out of the factory. Is the condenser a used one? Looks like it is because the ventilation fins are corroded and the paint is flaking off from the front. Also, I think they've installed the condenser the wrong way. The fins at the bottom should be pointing front of the vehicle to draw air through the condenser. And the condenser fan should be pulling air through it. Is that how the fan works? If the fan is pushing air (instead of pulling), then you can try reversing it so that the radiator gets enough air that's pushed out from the condenser fan.

The other thing is, if you are using R134a refrigerant (which I'm sure you are) and if that condenser if a parallel flow condenser (tubes running in a zig-zag fashion from top to bottom), then installing it horizontally isn't recommended. This is because the lubricant that's in the system will eventually get deposited in the condenser (because refrigerant is lighter than the lubricant and will separate away) is and starve the compressor. If this happens, the compressor will fail prematurely.

 

33 minutes ago, nuwan26 said:

the guy who fitted this condenser told me to clean radiator..what's thats mean? cleaning surface or cleaning inside?(like flushing)

They're referring to getting your cooling system flushed and the radiator core cleaned. You can give it a try, but since the vehicle never overheated before the new condenser was installed, I don't think there's anything wrong with the radiator.

Edited May 8, 2018 by Davy

[nuwan26]

53 minutes ago, Davy said:

If I were you, i'd look into the possibility of getting it sorted out the correct way by installing the condenser and the radiator parallel to each other like it came out of the factory. Is the condenser a used one? Looks like it is because the ventilation fins are corroded and the paint is flaking off from the front. Also, I think they've installed the condenser the wrong way. The fins at the bottom should be pointing front of the vehicle to draw air through the condenser. And the condenser fan should be pulling air through it. Is that how the fan works? If the fan is pushing air (instead of pulling), then you can try reversing it so that the radiator gets enough air that's pushed out from the condenser fan.

The other thing is, if you are using R134a refrigerant (which I'm sure you are) and if that condenser if a parallel flow condenser (tubes running in a zig-zag fashion from top to bottom), then installing it horizontally isn't recommended. This is because the lubricant that's in the system will eventually get deposited in the condenser (because refrigerant is lighter than the lubricant and will separate away) is and starve the compressor. If this happens, the compressor will fail prematurely.

 

They're referring to getting your cooling system flushed and the radiator core cleaned. You can give it a try, but since the vehicle never overheated before the new condenser was installed, I don't think there's anything wrong with the radiator.

yes it's used one.he told me that factory condenser can't cool much.he showed me lot of removed factory condensers.that removed by front a/c vans and fitted with used dual fan condenser.

as you assumed it  fan pushing air to down side..so if we change fins side we have to reverse fan...but do you think it's possible because it's having dc motor..but i will check is there something to do..

is there any working temperature for condenser? if we change fins side will condenser over cool or something?

what do you thing about removing finds? it's risky for condenser?

yeah.vehicle not overheated before.only with A/C engine heat getting high.

 

what we do for that gas problem?should we change it for different gas?i don't know tubes running in which side..can i see it through fins? 

Edited May 8, 2018 by nuwan26

[Davy]

21 hours ago, nuwan26 said:

yes it's used one.he told me that factory condenser can't cool much.he showed me lot of removed factory condensers.that removed by front a/c vans and fitted with used dual fan condenser.

Local Johnnies can make up all sorts of stories to snatch some money out of your pocket. I assume this is a CR27 DX? If yes, obviously the front AC alone can't cool the entire van if you have full seats installed (instead of just the one bench seat). I've driven and travelled in a few CR 27 vans (with and without Dual AC) and the front AC can feel insufficient to the back of the van on a warm day (more or less every day in Sri Lanka).

 

21 hours ago, nuwan26 said:

as you assumed it  fan pushing air to down side..so if we change fins side we have to reverse fan...but do you think it's possible because it's having dc motor..but i will check is there something to do..

is there any working temperature for condenser? if we change fins side will condenser over cool or something?

First observe if the fan is pulling air through the condenser or pushing it through. If it's pulling (which I think it is), then you can't change anything. But if its pushing, you can look into the possibility of changing the fan.

No there is no working temperature for the condenser. The cooler it can make the refrigerant, the better. 

 

21 hours ago, nuwan26 said:

what do you thing about removing finds? it's risky for condenser?

Probably not a good idea, the metal shield with fins actually acts as a protector against rocks and stuff from hitting the condenser and causing a leak. It should be there. It just looks like it's  installed backwards. If the fan is pushing air though, then it makes sense for the shield to be installed this way.

 

21 hours ago, nuwan26 said:

what we do for that gas problem?should we change it for different gas?i don't know tubes running in which side..can i see it through fins? 

I don't think you will find older types of refrigerant that easily. R134a is the new standard and it's in compliance with the CFC and environmental regulations. Older types of refrigerants have CFC and are harmful to the environment. Your van would have come with a CFC free refrigerant from the factory, given that it was manufactured in 1993.

 

Again... my advise for you is to get the system properly re-done. Get the condenser installed the way it came from the factory. If you think cooling will be insufficient, then look into the option of doing a dual AC conversion.

[nuwan26]

8 hours ago, Davy said:

1- First observe if the fan is pulling air through the condenser or pushing it through. If it's pulling (which I think it is), then you can't change anything. But if its pushing, you can look into the possibility of changing the fan.

2- No there is no working temperature for the condenser. The cooler it can make the refrigerant, the better. 

 

3-Probably not a good idea, the metal shield with fins actually acts as a protector against rocks and stuff from hitting the condenser and causing a leak. It should be there. It just looks like it's  installed backwards. If the fan is pushing air though, then it makes sense for the shield to be installed this way.

 

4-I don't think you will find older types of refrigerant that easily. R134a is the new standard and it's in compliance with the CFC and environmental regulations. Older types of refrigerants have CFC and are harmful to the environment. Your van would have come with a CFC free refrigerant from the factory, given that it was manufactured in 1993.

 

5-Again... my advise for you is to get the system properly re-done. Get the condenser installed the way it came from the factory. If you think cooling will be insufficient, then look into the option of doing a dual AC conversion.

4

1-yeah fans pushing air through condenser.to downside.not pulling.

3-yeah air pushing through condenser.so this way is right. if i turn it. then i have to reverse or do something to fan.

5-A/C man said this is the condenser that using for dual conversion.now he said now he only have to install pipe line with vents and joint them.he showed me how it's doing that.but i can't remember it now.

but at the beginning, he said something like that.he said there is 2 ways. install this condenser or joint another condenser to exisiting condenser(factory one).i had no idea.so i choosed this..seems like joining another condenser to old one is good way.i assume it's installing front of radiator with old condenser..so there is no barrier to air flow.

[Twin Turbo]

On 5/8/2018 at 2:40 PM, nuwan26 said:

the guy who fitted this condenser told me to clean radiator..what's thats mean? cleaning surface or cleaning inside?(like flushing)

For best results,do Both.and check the operating temp with the dash meter at half  on the coolant top hose inC'.

As the dash meter might be inaccurate. 

Edited May 11, 2018 by Twin Turbo

[Piyumal thili]

Toyota town ace van ekk thiynwa 52 number ekk eka nawaththala gdk wela thibbma start wenne ne beei wela hri start unath newathunoth aaye start wen ne thallu krma start wnwa. Kohe hri durka gihin neweththuwoth nawaththapu gaman gehuwama wadinwa hebei winadi 5k hri giyoth aaye wadinne ne garidge godkta demma eth eylta lede hoygnda be puluwn kenek help ekk dnwda please