Accord Hybrid VS Camry Hybrid

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

Hi experts,

I'm looking for a midsize car these days. I shortlisted the ninth gen Accord Hybrid and seventh gen Camry hybrid . Actually I like Accord more. If you have any experience or any idea about following things please tell me. 

1. Cost of hybrid battery replacement ( Brand new or reconditioned).

2. Life time of the battery 

3. Any common problems.

4. Fuel consumption ( Only for knowledge ?)

5. Your ideas about these two cars.

Edited November 7, 2020 by Sadeepa Dilhara

[iRage]

No idea about 1 and 2

3. 

Camry : Nothing drastically bad. The first few years of the model had an issue with lower control arm and strut connecting knuckle and as a result the bushes went bad prematurely. I believe Toyota Japan fixed them under recall//warranty. So just pay attention to that.

In addition there were some service campaigns to check some other small issues.

Accord : For starters...if the car has CTBA and Cruise Control...you better check if that works...it had issues which made the car go bonkers and at times not work. I believe there was also a recall on the earlier releases of the model because the airbag deflating (gas or whatever) lost its potency over time (something to do with change of temperature making the gas less potent, thus effecting deployment).

Honda's vehicle systems are highly integrated. Almost all Hondas of the era (Vezel to Fit) had issues with all sorts of different systems throwing out errors (which have been a pain to properly pinpoint a cause of). This is more common in Hybrid models than pure gasoline ones because of the additional systems and the Hybrid system's dependency on other systems such as braking, etc...howevever, the Accord has a slightly different setup than the Fit and Fit based models like the Vezel, so it does not seem to be as plagued as these Fit based models. Just keep that in mind.

4. No idea about Sri Lanka...but the demo vehicle Camry I remember did somewhere around 20kmpl and rental Accord did about 25~ish ? Again...this was in Japan and I am going by memory...so do not quote me on this.

5. Both cars, inside and outside, feel well put together and nice and tight. However, the Accord is definitely the more refined feeling car in terms of build and finish. The Accord's interior surfaces feel more soft and expensive whilst the Camry feels a bit plasticy. Even the fake wood panels on the Accord have a more refined color and gloss to it than the Camry's. However, I did feel like the Accord's interior  was designed for old people with poor eyesight and fiddly fingers with those huge screens and bulky knobs and buttons

"Drive-ability" wise, the Accord was much more engaging. The Camry was typical Toyota,there was minimal feedback from the car (the New Camry is miles miles and miles better than the one you are looking at if you can swing it). Comfort wise...if you like a soft cloudy/floaty ride...then I would say the Camry is the car for you...but if you want a comfortable yet sporty feeling ride...then Accord should be your choice.

At the end of the day..I feel the Camry will be an easier car to use and run. However, if you are a person who likes cars and driving, the Accord will be the car you would love to own.

 

 

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

Thank you very much for your detailed reply.

3 hours ago, iRage said:

believe there was also a recall on the earlier releases of the model because the airbag deflating (gas or whatever) lost its potency over time (something to do with change of temperature making the gas less potent, thus effecting deployment).

How to check it? Any idea..

 

3 hours ago, iRage said:

Accord has a slightly different setup than the Fit and Fit based models like the Vezel, so it does not seem to be as plagued as these Fit based models. Just keep that in mind.

Oh yes. It has 1 speed blah blah blah transmission and I think it has the same technology of new insight. I guess it is a successful and reliable technology unlike vezel, gp5 etc. just because it is used in new insight. Isn't it?

 

3 hours ago, iRage said:

Honda's vehicle systems are highly integrated. Almost all Hondas of the era (Vezel to Fit) had issues with all sorts of different systems throwing out errors (which have been a pain to properly pinpoint a cause of).

Will it become a money pit or painful for brain?

3 hours ago, iRage said:

but if you want a comfortable yet sporty feeling ride...then Accord should be your choice.

Is it more comfortable than so called ultra luxury premio ?????

Edited November 7, 2020 by Sadeepa Dilhara

[iRage]

14 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

How to check it? Any idea..

sadly no...if it was replaced in Japan there would be a sticker indicating and recall repairs (but those could be removed). Or you would need to see a work order report...or you will need to remove it and then check if the detenator  has been replaced.

14 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

. just because it is used in new insight. Isn't it?

The technology being used does not mean it is good or bad...the Vezel continues to have the same mechanism. So did the Fit until the entire model was changed earlier this year. The system changed because the entire power/drive train changed. Not because Honda felt that the previous system was bad. In fact the previous mechanism was good. It is just that it did not suit out-side-of-Japan driving styles (which is why the export models of the Fit and Vezel came only with standard CVT).

 

14 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Will it become a money pit or painful for brain?

Depends on your luck. Granted you do hear far less issues with the Accord system than the Vezel and the Fit, but then there are far less numbers of Accords than Vezels and Fits.

14 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Is it more comfortable than so called ultra luxury premio ?????

If you are looking for comfort...then Camry....both cars are as comfortable (or even slightly bit more than) the Premio. However, to be fair the Premio is pretty comfortable. Especially the 2000cc variant with better seats and additional sound and vibration dampening. Drive both and see which one works for you best. 

[Magnum]

Why dont you consider the Mazda 6 as well?

[mcs627]

A good buddy of mine was considering the above same sedans but  the current models in 2018 during the engine capacity based vehicle import duty era before the luxury tax. The Accord he loved it and almost bought it. In the end he bought a BMW 530e simply because there were far more on the roads of Colombo and spares and repairs in that context would be more easier (and the import duty was similar or less for the bimmer compared to the other 2). Camry Hybrid  will be mechanically similar to all other Toyota hybrids with HSD but parts will be scarce - hence identifying a problem maybe easy but to fix it one  may have to order parts and wait. The Accord differs mechanically from the Fit Hybrid and Vezel & the agent I doubt has much experience with it and once issues crop up finding a capable repair center may be challenging and parts even more so. But the Accord Hybrid is one lean machine.

Edited November 8, 2020 by mcs627

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

4 hours ago, iRage said:

sadly no...if it was replaced in Japan there would be a sticker indicating and recall repairs (but those could be removed). Or you would need to see a work order report...or you will need to remove it and then check if the detenator  has been replaced.

The technology being used does not mean it is good or bad...the Vezel continues to have the same mechanism. So did the Fit until the entire model was changed earlier this year. The system changed because the entire power/drive train changed. Not because Honda felt that the previous system was bad. In fact the previous mechanism was good. It is just that it did not suit out-side-of-Japan driving styles (which is why the export models of the Fit and Vezel came only with standard CVT).

 

Depends on your luck. Granted you do hear far less issues with the Accord system than the Vezel and the Fit, but then there are far less numbers of Accords than Vezels and Fits.

If you are looking for comfort...then Camry....both cars are as comfortable (or even slightly bit more than) the Premio. However, to be fair the Premio is pretty comfortable. Especially the 2000cc variant with better seats and additional sound and vibration dampening. Drive both and see which one works for you best. 

Thank you so much ?. My heart says Accord. My brain says Camry.

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

3 hours ago, Magnum said:

Why dont you consider the Mazda 6 as well?

Actually this car is not for me. It is for my dad(as our family car). I'm still 18 years old.

My father don't like the look of Mazda 6. He says it looks too much sporty for his liking.

 

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

19 minutes ago, mcs627 said:

A good buddy of mine was considering the above same sedans but  the current models in 2018 during the engine capacity based vehicle import duty era before the luxury tax. The Accord he loved it and almost bought it. In the end he bought a BMW 530e simply because there were far more on the roads of Colombo and spares and repairs in that context would be more easier (and the import duty was similar or less for the bimmer compared to the other 2). Camry Hybrid  will be mechanically similar to all other Toyota hybrids with HSD but parts will be scarce - hence identifying a problem maybe easy but to fix it one  may have to order parts and wait. The Accord differs mechanically from the Fit Hybrid and Vezel & the agent I doubt has much experience with it and once issues crop up finding a capable repair center may be challenging and parts even more so. But the Accord Hybrid is one lean machine.

Actually lack of spare parts is a big question mark for me because I'm in Kurunegala. Not in colombo..  

Edited November 8, 2020 by Sadeepa Dilhara

[sathyajithj99]

1 hour ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Actually this car is not for me. It is for my dad(as our family car). I'm still 18 years old.

My father don't like the look of Mazda 6. He says it looks too much sporty for his liking.

 

For your dad Camry would do. 

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

1 hour ago, sathyajithj99 said:

For your dad Camry would do. 

Actually I'm the driver of the car in most of our road trips ?. So I like to drive Accord?.

Another thing is, we have a CHR currently as our city runabout car.( He likes the design of CHR but don't like the design of mazda 6??). So he is get used to the things like rain sensing wipers, automatic high beam, radar cruise control etc.

Camry(2013-14) doesn't have any of those. But well equipped Accords have most of the above features.. 

Edited November 8, 2020 by Sadeepa Dilhara

[sathyajithj99]

33 minutes ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Actually I'm the driver of the car in most of our road trips ?. So I like to drive Accord?.

Another thing is, we have a CHR currently as our city runabout car.( He likes the design of CHR but don't like the design of mazda 6??). So he is get used to the things like rain sensing wipers, automatic high beam, radar cruise control etc.

Camry(2013-14) doesn't have any of those. But well equipped Accords have most of the above features.. 

If your dad grew on CHR it won't be difficult to get him to like the looks of Mazda6. Try to do so. You won't regret with a Mazda6.

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

@iRage, @sathyajithj99, @Magnum

Is mazda 6 comfortable? Most of YouTube car journalists says it is bit stiff. But most of them are talking about high spec car with 19" wheels. What about the mazda 6 with 17" rims. Is it stiffer than CHR.

Edited November 8, 2020 by Sadeepa Dilhara

[sathyajithj99]

26 minutes ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

@iRage, @sathyajithj99, @Magnum

Is mazda 6 comfortable? Most of YouTube car journalists says it is bit stiff. But most of them are talking about high spec car with 19" wheels. What about the mazda 6 with 17" rims. Is it stiffer than CHR.

Compared to most Toyotas of the same era like allion, premio, aqua  the CHR has a bit stiffer suspension due to it was more focused on handling during its designing. But thereis not much to complain about comfort like in a Honda Vezel RS which feels like a lorry. Anyway Mazd6 is roomier and though it was more focused on handling , it's decently comfortable (not boat like comfort in a boring premio ). In SL 19" rims came with 2.5L high spec one (agent imports) 17"came with 2L one. I guess 19" has low profile tyres which makes it less comfortable than the 17" one

[iRage]

12 hours ago, mcs627 said:

Camry Hybrid  will be mechanically similar to all other Toyota hybrids with HSD

Mechanically same but the way it is programmed is different.

 

6 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Is mazda 6 comfortable

Compared to the Accord and Camry (i.e. other cars in its class); the 6 has firmer suspension. You really cannot compare the comfort of a cross over with a sedan. 

 

9 hours ago, Sadeepa Dilhara said:

Camry(2013-14) doesn't have any of those. But well equipped Accords have most of the above features.

You are looking at a lower grade Camry. 

[john cooper]

We do have two of them, one in NZ and one in SL

Wife use the 2012 Hybrid Camry done 150k and no issues what so ever. It is a jap import G grade car (As per auction sheet) 

She get about 20 Km/L mix run and continues highway drive is about 17 Km/L

In SL, we bought the Camry i think 2015 or 16, but it's a face lift top of the line model (Similer to Atara SL) include the automatic rare blinders.

It has only done 25k when i have last been to SL in 2019, get's about 16 km/L

Both 2.5 and pulls really good and had no issues. Only service through the agents as recommended 

My wife had done 50k for last 5 years and we haven't done any major maintenance (We have done the 100k Toyota service) other than usual service/ wheel alignment, etc.

regards,

JC.

[Sadeepa Dilhara]

@sathyajithj99, @iRage, @john cooper Thank you all for the advices.

[Dhaham]

On 11/8/2020 at 12:18 PM, iRage said:

However, to be fair the Premio is pretty comfortable.

Dear iRage

We know that rear suspension of Camry is double wishbone and that of premio is cheapest and simplest torsion beam. So, how can premio be so much comfortable?

[iRage]

6 hours ago, Dhaham said:

Dear iRage

We know that rear suspension of Camry is double wishbone and that of premio is cheapest and simplest torsion beam. So, how can premio be so much comfortable?

Being cheap vs. complicated and torsion bar vs double wishbone has little to do with comfort.  What makes a or breaks comfort are quite dependent on things like the damping rate of the dampers, spring rate, bushes, sound and vibration dampening materials used and even the seats. Point and case....almost all of the old rear wheel drive cars of the past pretty much had live beam axels in the back which pretty much the same as a torsion beam (the axel being the rigid metal beam running across) and those sedans are far more comfortable more than a lot of moderns sedans.

Torsion beams are actually pretty good at absorbing bumps because the entire suspension system travels with the bump as opposed to an IS setup where each side acts opposite to each other. Here lies the biggest issue with torsion beam...this elastic like rear suspension setup translates to poor handling; which is the main issue of torsion beam setups...but granted most modern cars that use Torsen beam these days are still quite well balanced that the effects of the beam are minimized. Does that mean double wishbone or any other method is not or less comfortable ? No...its just that it does things differently....and the way some systems work takes away some of the weaknesses of another.

As for the Premio...it has a very very soft suspension setup and has a lot of dampening..so it has a very buoyant ride and a lot of dampening. In fact, many people who have used Premios and Allions find cars like the Mark X, Camry and even BMWs and Mercs not as comfortable because the latter cars are setup to be a bit more firm.

[Dhaham]

4 hours ago, iRage said:

Being cheap vs. complicated and torsion bar vs double wishbone has little to do with comfort.  What makes a or breaks comfort are quite dependent on things like the damping rate of the dampers, spring rate, bushes, sound and vibration dampening materials used and even the seats. Point and case....almost all of the old rear wheel drive cars of the past pretty much had live beam axels in the back which pretty much the same as a torsion beam (the axel being the rigid metal beam running across) and those sedans are far more comfortable more than a lot of moderns sedans.

Torsion beams are actually pretty good at absorbing bumps because the entire suspension system travels with the bump as opposed to an IS setup where each side acts opposite to each other. Here lies the biggest issue with torsion beam...this elastic like rear suspension setup translates to poor handling; which is the main issue of torsion beam setups...but granted most modern cars that use Torsen beam these days are still quite well balanced that the effects of the beam are minimized. Does that mean double wishbone or any other method is not or less comfortable ? No...its just that it does things differently....and the way some systems work takes away some of the weaknesses of another.

As for the Premio...it has a very very soft suspension setup and has a lot of dampening..so it has a very buoyant ride and a lot of dampening. In fact, many people who have used Premios and Allions find cars like the Mark X, Camry and even BMWs and Mercs not as comfortable because the latter cars are setup to be a bit more firm.

Dear iRage

Thank you very much for your explanation. I have read many of your replies written to Auto Lanka forum. All of them are very clearly expressed. In addition to the knowledge gained by your replies, what I have understood is, you are one of the most senior automobile engineers in the island (although I don't know your actual name).

Another big thanks to Auto Lanka team for providing this forum and all the resource persons who share there knowledge by replying our questions. 

[Magnum]

The way I see it, Camry is basically a bigger Premio. Camry makes sense in a market where the Premio doesnt exist. In SL, I would look for other options.

[kush]

3 hours ago, Magnum said:

The way I see it, Camry is basically a bigger Premio. Camry makes sense in a market where the Premio doesnt exist. In SL, I would look for other options.

Camry is from the bigger segment. Has loads of space in rear seats and boot than the Premio.

It is significantly more comfortable due to better seats especially the rear once due to better leg room and thigh support.

Drives and rides better due to better suspension set up and bigger engine.

Similarly you can refer to C Class and E class or 3 Series and 5 Series and all of us know the differences.

 

 

[iRage]

5 hours ago, Magnum said:

The way I see it, Camry is basically a bigger Premio. Camry makes sense in a market where the Premio doesnt exist. In SL, I would look for other options.

Not exactly....the Camry is better equipped...and although has the typical Toyota disconnect...it does handle a lot better than the Premio and the extra weight and dampening does make it a lot better on long drives. The difference between the two was the same as the Corona and Mark II back in the day...

[iRage]

6 hours ago, Dhaham said:

you are one of the most senior automobile engineers in the islan

Well...I am glad to help out..but I am not an automobile engineer at all...just messed around with a too few many cars  As for my profession...I figure out how technology can be used to distribute drugs...

EDIT : For clarification...LEGAL DRUGS !!! The kind that cures people if and when properly used  

Edited November 13, 2020 by iRage

[Dhaham]

1 hour ago, iRage said:

but I am not an automobile engineer at all.

That is marvellous. Being in another profession, but gaining such a deep knowledge on cars. If you are not an automobile engineer, your hobby must be in auto field. Infact, when I was new to this forum, I guessed you are Mr.L#l Al#wat#a or somebody like him. But later I understood that you are not him.

Anyway, we are lucky to get advices from people like you.

@Auto Lanka team, I'm sorry for talking little bit on a different subject.