Things To Check(Look Into) When Buying A 10-15 Old Car

ravindasenarath · February 24, 2015

Hi friends,

When you are buying a bit old car ( 10 - 15 years ), when you went to check the vehicle what are the specific things to check. I'm going to to buy a car around 1.5M. So my choices are Nissan fb 14, Nissan AD ~1999, Nissan wingroad ~1999 etc. Following are the things that I usually check.

Body(specially edges for rust)
Spaces between doors, bonnet buffer fittings etc
Whether all doors close and open gently
I push the car down in four corners and check the bounce. As per my knowledge if it bounce passing it's original height from floor suspension is bad.
Radiator over flow for color, rust
Checking for rust under the radiator cap
Engine oil level and oil colour
Any oil marks/leeks in engine
Try to rotate radiator fans by finger ( to check whether they turn gently)
Break fluid colour, thickness
Transmission oil level ( Usually I couldn't find the dipstick for this)
Power steering oil level ( Where is it ? )
Start the engine and listen to the sound (whether it run smoothly)
Put hand to the tail pipe and smell for petrol
Check inside of tail pipe for oily black stuff
Interior stuff ( check whether all works )
Check whether wheels wobble

I learn these by watching youtube videos . So is there anything I'm doing wrong or any other things that I can check. Perhaps Sri Lanka specific things to check or things specific to car modes that I mention.

Magnum · March 2, 2015

On 3/1/2015 at 6:37 AM, Davy said:
This is totally wrong. You can buy a decent pre-facelift (say 2001/2002) CS1 for around 1.6M. It is the CS3 that could go up to about 1.8M max.
Examples (CS1):

http://autolanka.com/ad.asp?ID=175393

Examples (CS3):

http://autolanka.com/ad.asp?ID=174150

http://autolanka.com/ad.asp?ID=174068

I don't know where you have been looking, but you've been looking at the wrong cars.

Whats the difference between CS1 and CS3? is it that CS1 is 1300cc and CS3 is 1500cc? CS2 is the JDM model right?

Edited March 2, 2015 by Magnum

Crosswind · March 2, 2015

1300cc cars have lower value generally because of the low pulling power. Try climbing a hill on an auto 1300cc car. You will find out yourself. They also do bad on fuel compared to 1500 cc version because the engine needs to exert itself. Having said that, Lancers are a slight exception as I noticed CS1 with a 1300cc has decent pulling power. However I have driven 1300 cc FB15 and BJ3P. They ar pathetic.

@magnum CS1 = 1300CC CS2=1500CC and CS3=1600CC

15lakhs for B15 (1300CC) is a decent price.

Edited March 2, 2015 by Crosswind

Davy · March 2, 2015

On 3/2/2015 at 2:59 PM, Magnum said:
Whats the difference between CS1 and CS3? is it that CS1 is 1300cc and CS3 is 1500cc? CS2 is the JDM model right?

Crosswind is correct with his reply above.

Also, the CS2 is not the JDM model. Most of the pre-facelift CS2s in the country are JDM, but there are a few export model examples as well. The most commonly seen JDM CS2 is the Lancer Cedia (Cedia meaning CEntury DIAmond - "Century" because it was the model done on the company's 100th anniversary. "Diamond" because that's what the Mitsubishi logo is composed of). Most of the Cedias came with a 1.5L GDI engine whereas the export model CS2 came with a 1.5 EFI engine (both 4G15).

The CS1, 2 and 3 are not the only CS Lancers that were in the series. The CS ranges from CS1 (4G13 - 1.3L) to CS9 (4G63T - 2.0L Mivec Turbo). The only CS I've seen locally apart from the common 1, 2 and 3 is the CS5. It badged "Touring" and has a 1.8L engine (4G93) - one was on sale on the classifieds a couple of years back.

Edited March 2, 2015 by Davy

Magnum · March 3, 2015

On 3/2/2015 at 11:40 PM, Davy said:
Crosswind is correct with his reply above.
Also, the CS2 is not the JDM model. Most of the pre-facelift CS2s in the country are JDM, but there are a few export model examples as well. The most commonly seen JDM CS2 is the Lancer Cedia (Cedia meaning CEntury DIAmond - "Century" because it was the model done on the company's 100th anniversary. "Diamond" because that's what the Mitsubishi logo is composed of). Most of the Cedias came with a 1.5L GDI engine whereas the export model CS2 came with a 1.5 EFI engine (both 4G15).

The CS1, 2 and 3 are not the only CS Lancers that were in the series. The CS ranges from CS1 (4G13 - 1.3L) to CS9 (4G63T - 2.0L Mivec Turbo). The only CS I've seen locally apart from the common 1, 2 and 3 is the CS5. It badged "Touring" and has a 1.8L engine (4G93) - one was on sale on the classifieds a couple of years back.

Is it successful here? The Pajero with GDI wasn't

Davy · March 3, 2015

On 3/3/2015 at 4:35 AM, Magnum said:
Is it successful here? The Pajero with GDI wasn't

People were initially skeptical about GDI engines, thinking that they give trouble. That's probably the main reason as to why Mitsubishis with GDI engines (Lancer, Galant, Pajero IO and Monetro) were not that successful. Honestly, I also turned away from GDI Lancers at the time of buying mine. But the truth is, they are reliable engines if maintained properly.

If I remember correctly, these GDI engines were meant to run on 98 octane petrol. Due to the unavailability of 98 in the country, people were forced to use 95 octane (some may have used 90 - not knowing the implications) which probably resulted in most of these engines giving trouble. So there's nothing actually wrong with GDI engines. They lost their reputation due to the wrong reasons IMO.

trinity · March 3, 2015

On 3/3/2015 at 4:59 AM, Davy said:
People were initially skeptical about GDI engines, thinking that they give trouble. That's probably the main reason as to why Mitsubishis with GDI engines (Lancer, Galant, Pajero IO and Monetro) were not that successful. Honestly, I also turned away from GDI Lancers at the time of buying mine. But the truth is, they are reliable engines if maintained properly.
If I remember correctly, these GDI engines were meant to run on 98 octane petrol. Due to the unavailability of 98 in the country, people were forced to use 95 octane (some may have used 90 - not knowing the implications) which probably resulted in most of these engines giving trouble. So there's nothing actually wrong with GDI engines. They lost their reputation due to the wrong reasons IMO.

AFIK 95 octane was not available back in the day when these cars were imported (Actually when was it CEYPETCO introduced 95 to SL?). So due to this users had no other option but to pump 90.

ravindasenarath · March 3, 2015

Guys a advice or two on Mazda BJ5P 2000/2001as well

there are 1300 cc and 1500cc , YOM's 1999-2003. Help on reasonable prices for these models please

BTW I heard that BJ3P/BJ5P is not good on fuel and parts are expensive.

Also wanted to know the reasonable price for 1999 and 2000 fb 15's ( People normally put 17/18 )

Edited March 3, 2015 by ravindasenarath

trinity · March 3, 2015

Adding to Davys post above, Cedia being the JDM Lancer it came with all bells and whistles that Brand new imports never had. Also for an auto it does fairly well on fuel and have a decent pulling power. Too bad market flopped for those cars in SL.

The Don · March 3, 2015

On 3/3/2015 at 5:32 AM, trinity said:
AFIK 95 octane was not available back in the day when these cars were imported (Actually when was it CEYPETCO introduced 95 to SL?). So due to this users had no other option but to pump 90.

We had 95 octane petrol since the late 1990s. The problem with the GDi system is not the octane figure but impurities in fuel.

The high pressure direct injection system never worked to full efficiency outside Japan due to the inferior quality of fuel found elsewhere including Europe. The problem was sulphur content amongst other contaminants, which ultimately would lead to the premature failiure of components like the high pressure fuel pump.

Not running fuel of correct octane figure usually results in ignition knocks and in worst case scenarios the vehicle not starting up. The GDi fiasco was a little different. Ironically while it was Mitsubishi who mass marketed the technology, a lot manufacturers now use it as standard on their engines.

Davy · March 4, 2015

The Don said:

We had 95 octane petrol since the late 1990s. The problem with the GDi system is not the octane figure but impurities in fuel.

The high pressure direct injection system never worked to full efficiency outside Japan due to the inferior quality of fuel found elsewhere including Europe. The problem was sulphur content amongst other contaminants, which ultimately would lead to the premature failiure of components like the high pressure fuel pump.

Not running fuel of correct octane figure usually results in ignition knocks and in worst case scenarios the vehicle not starting up. The GDi fiasco was a little different. Ironically while it was Mitsubishi who mass marketed the technology, a lot manufacturers now use it as standard on their engines.

What happens usually when you pump a lower grade octane fuel is that the engine's knock sensor retards the engine's timing to prevent knocking or pinging. So it is unlikely that you'll feel severe knocking even though you have used fuel of a lower octane rating. Retarded timing for prolonged periods can cause issues.

A few years ago when I was reading up on this issue on Cedia's, I read that, as a result of retarded timing (due to the use of lower octane fuels), carbon deposits tend to form up on the intake valves, causing them to not close properly (See photo below).

Once again, what I read attributed the build up of this carbon deposits to the use of lower grade octane fuels. As a result of this carbon build up, early GDI engines (pioneered by manufacturers such as Mitsubishi) were frowned upon.

So while other factors such as inferior fuel quality also played a role in destroying these engines, the use of lower octane fuel was also a main contributor.

LashNeo · March 4, 2015

On 3/3/2015 at 5:38 AM, ravindasenarath said:
Guys a advice or two on Mazda BJ5P 2000/2001as well
there are 1300 cc and 1500cc , YOM's 1999-2003. Help on reasonable prices for these models please

BTW I heard that BJ3P/BJ5P is not good on fuel and parts are expensive.

Also wanted to know the reasonable price for 1999 and 2000 fb 15's ( People normally put 17/18 )

As someone who upgraded from a FB14 to a BJ5P years ago and after owning it for 5+ years running it for more than 50,000+ Km’s I can always recommend you the BJ5P over the B14. If you need details on the nightmares I had with my FB14, refer this thread.

http://forum.autolanka.com/topic/15880-best-sedan-car-for-13-lks/page-2?hl=%2Blashneo+%2Bfb14#entry257896

Probably my FB14 was a melon and because of that I faced all these problems. But all in all considering the general comments I get from other FB14 users as well, I can tell you that the BJ5P stands ahead of B14.

Since your main concern is on pricing, based on the current market, generally the prices should be as follows;

BJ5P pre-face lift (1998-1999) = 11.0 – 15.5 lakhs (Non English numbered ones are going cheap these days. One of my friends sold his 300 series BJ5P for 10.5 lakhs. But it had done well over 200,000km’s and needed a new paint job)
BJ5P facelifted model (2000-2003) = 15.5 – 18 lakhs
BJ3P’s should be priced around 1-1.5lakhs below similar aged BJ5P’s.

BJ series has several variants. If you’re going for a high spec one which comes with the ZL-VE engine with VVT, All disk brakes, Leather seats, Trip-tronic gears Climate control A/C etc. it should cost 0.5-1.5lakhs more than a basic BJ5P in similar condition.

Fuel economy of BJ’s is not that bad. My one does around 8-9 in city limits and it’s an Auto. For an average sized sedan which is around 15 years old that’s not a bad figure in my opinion.

Edited March 6, 2015 by LashNeo

The Don · March 4, 2015

On 3/4/2015 at 2:38 AM, Davy said:

What happens usually when you pump a lower grade octane fuel is that the engine's knock sensor retards the engine's timing to prevent knocking or pinging. So it is unlikely that you'll feel severe knocking even though you have used fuel of a lower octane rating. Retarded timing for prolonged periods can cause issues.

A few years ago when I was reading up on this issue on Cedia's, I read that, as a result of retarded timing (due to the use of lower octane fuels), carbon deposits tend to form up on the intake valves, causing them to not close properly (See photo below).

Once again, what I read attributed the build up of this carbon deposits to the use of lower grade octane fuels. As a result of this carbon build up, early GDI engines (pioneered by manufacturers such as Mitsubishi) were frowned upon.

So while other factors such as inferior fuel quality also played a role in destroying these engines, the use of lower octane fuel was also a main contributor.

I also think this is more to do with fuel quality than the octane figure.

I recently saw on a BMW engine valve deposits so high that the carbon has heated up and eaten away at the metal causing the valve to leak. In the UK this sort of issue is attributed to low quality fuel rather than the correct octane grading, as this particular vehicle does not need high octane fuel (It was an E39 520i).

To be fair GDi didn't work that well anywhere outside Japan. I think it was a failure of the famed Japanese quality control, where they did not check the component tolerance to lower quality fuel enough.

ravindasenarath · March 4, 2015

On 3/4/2015 at 10:56 AM, LashNeo said:
As someone who upgraded from a FB14 to a BJ5P years ago and after owning it for 5+ years running it for more than 50,000+ Km’s I can always recommend you the BJ5P over the B14. If you need details on the nightmares I had with my FB14, refer this thread.
http://forum.autolanka.com/topic/15880-best-sedan-car-for-13-lks/page-2?hl=%2Blashneo+%2Bfb14#entry257896

Probably my FB14 was a melon and because of that I faced all these problems. But all in all considering the general comments I get from other FB14 users as well, I can tell you that the BJ5P stands ahead of B14.

Since your main concern is on pricing, based on the current market, generally the prices should be as follows;

BJ5P pre-face lift (1998-1999) = 11.0 – 15.5 lakhs (Non English numbered ones are going cheap these days. One of my friends sold his 300 series BJ5P for 10.5 lakhs. But it had done well over 200,000km’s and needed a new paint job)

BJ5P facelifted model (2000-2003) = 15.5 – 18 lakhs

BJ3P’s should be priced around 1-1.5lakhs below similar aged BJ5P’s.

BJ series has several variants. If you’re going for a high spec one which comes with the ZL-VE engine with VVT, All disk brakes, Leather sheets, Trip-tronic gears Climate control A/C etc. it should cost 0.5-1.5lakhs more than a basic BJ5P in similar condition.

Fuel economy of BJ’s is not that bad. My one does around 8-9 in city limits and it’s an Auto. For an average sized sedan which is around 15 years old that’s not a bad figure in my opinion.

Great help LashNeo.

ravindasenarath · March 4, 2015

This must be a very stupid question. What does "open papers" means? Is it that car owner doesn't put his name in the book.

Edited March 4, 2015 by ravindasenarath

The Don · March 4, 2015

On 3/4/2015 at 1:58 PM, ravindasenarath said:
This must be a very stupid question. What does "open papers" means? Is it that car owner doesn't put his name in the book.

Not legally transferred to the current owner.

ravindasenarath · March 4, 2015

Why people do this? How can to current owner transfer vehicle to someone else? Does this have any effect on the price of the vehicle?

The Don · March 4, 2015

On 3/4/2015 at 2:48 PM, ravindasenarath said:
Why people do this? How can to current owner transfer vehicle to someone else? Does this have any effect on the price of the vehicle?

Well they do it to reduce the number of previous owners, and various other issues which are unique to the Sri Lankan market.

The transfer papers are signed but undated so there is no issue of getting the vehicle to a new owner. It usually does not affect the price.

ravindasenarath · March 10, 2015

Guys going to go for a Mazda BJ5P 99 special edition. http://www.autolanka.com/ad.asp?ID=174989

Got checked with mazna mortors . Have replace front right sock mount other than that all good. Wish me luck

Seeker LK · August 19, 2015

I have seen a car with Open papers. Car is in very good condition.

I'm just wondering if I go for leasing at a bank, would there be a problem? Would they offer cheque in a name other than the name of the owner's name in the book?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Magnum · August 19, 2015

Yes! It means the vehicle wasn't transfered to the new/present owner. The previous owner can claim the vehicle back legally but I haven't heard of that happening

Seeker LK · August 19, 2015

So I suppose since the legal owner is the old guy, Bank may refuse the give a cheque for the new guy's name? Too much confusions.. why these buggers do this to us lol. He has the forms singed by the old guy, and also said if I want I can meet the old owner guy too.

I paid 20K advance like a fool. Wondering whether I should confront him and ask the money back if getting a lease would be a problem. But then I have seen many open paper cars at sales. How do they manage?

Edited August 19, 2015 by Seeker LK

asrock · August 19, 2015

Since the previous owner has signed the transfer papers get the vehicle transfered to the present owner. Then the leasing company will issue the cheque to his name, after that the leasing company will get it transfered back to your name. But that means you get 3 owners in your book.

Seeker LK · August 20, 2015

On 8/19/2015 at 5:52 PM, asrock said:
Since the previous owner has signed the transfer papers get the vehicle transfered to the present owner. Then the leasing company will issue the cheque to his name, after that the leasing company will get it transfered back to your name. But that means you get 3 owners in your book.

Thanks for the tip.

Today I talked with two leasing guys. Both of them said it's ok and they can offer cheque in different name other than the one in the book. But I suppose bank won't agree to it as they are more rigid.

Has anyone gone through this open book / papers dilemma? What are your thoughts?

Reckless · August 20, 2015

My old car was on open papers too, the leasing company said to get it transferred to the current owner for them to issue the cheque to him.

Seeker LK · August 25, 2015

I think I've sorted it out. I'm going to get the car today with leasing. I'll write about it later today here. It might help when people start looking for cars.