Nissan X Trail Dci

[john cooper]

Hello Guys

Hope everyone is doing good, I crashed our truck few weeks back and its write-off by insurance, so we lost our honest KZN185 surf and have to move to a new one.

Wife want to get something with less rough looking but with ESC and some more air bags, i was lucky to escape without a single scratch after going through a concert wall because of the big truck.

So we start looking DNT31 Nissan X trail equipped with M9R Dci engine developed by Renault and Nissan

Its fits to our budget, specs and requirement at this time but i was doing some research about the engine and this has some common problems and unique problems

DPF issue which is common and EGR - if we are doing lots of short runs this is common for most of the modern clean diesel engine so if i got with any diesel have to go through the same kinda issue, as most of the time wife going to use this for work which about 30min drive (5min highway drive and rest is normal 50km road) and occasional long journeys.

As i have seen most of the people use the truck for long trips seems to be not have this DPF issue (according to AUS x-trail forum)

Unique issue with this engine - Engine oil on air filter due to oil separator leaks and this may not fixed under warranty looks like. so i would like to get some feedback from any X Trail users or experts about this issues and any other issues that i haven't notice with x trail or if you know any way to prevent or fix this.

Due to budget we can't go for a RAV4 D4D or Hyundai IX35

regards

JC

[The Don]

All common rail dielsel engines with DPF have the issue of clogged DPF if the regeneration cycle does not run properly. Most often the cause is short trips which does not allow for enough time for it to complete. My solution to this is usually an Italian tune up couple with a weekly long drive of at least 30 minutes at motorway speeds.

To be perfectly honest the Dci engines which are developed nearly completely by Renault are not rugged like the Nissan Diesels of old. They are not tolerant of bad fuel and while very efficient, throw hissy fits more often and cost more to fix. This is not a Renault specific issue as even the Legendry Hilux with the D4D engine seems to have become the same (read Aussie forums), but Nissan seems to have more problems than others.

So in order of reliability I would go I-Dtec> D4D > DiD > Dci

Hopefully the above will help you find a good truck. When we went to buy an X Trail for a friend we came home with a CRV

[john cooper]

Thank you Don

With the PRADO i don't have any issues yet (fingers crossed) and 120k on the clock so i trust the toyota but not able to affored at this point.

I am not worrying about the DPF as we do drive on highway enough to clear the DPF, but the issue with oil on the air cleaner is a big issue as we have to top up the burning oil in the middle of 10k service interval. so this gone be a pain for sure

I was start looking for Suzuki Grand Escudo/ Vitara but the DDI model is not good at all as Suzuki use another Renault engine so ended up with few Korean options like Sportage or Santa Fe CRDI

regards

JC

[The Don]

Thank you Don

With the PRADO i don't have any issues yet (fingers crossed) and 120k on the clock so i trust the toyota but not able to affored at this point.

I am not worrying about the DPF as we do drive on highway enough to clear the DPF, but the issue with oil on the air cleaner is a big issue as we have to top up the burning oil in the middle of 10k service interval. so this gone be a pain for sure

I was start looking for Suzuki Grand Escudo/ Vitara but the DDI model is not good at all as Suzuki use another Renault engine so ended up with few Korean options like Sportage or Santa Fe CRDI

regards

JC

In the UK there isn't much of a difference between the CRV I-DTec and the X Trail Dci, and the Rav 4 D4D is only slightly more expensive. Even the European versions use a lot of components made by Denso which was rather re assuring while the Dci mostly uses European components on the engine.

If there is oil in the air cleaner most probably the oil separator has gone bust. Its usually not very expensive to replace.

[john cooper]

By the looks of it replacement of the oil separator is expensive for X trail.

Any idea about the Sportage Series 2? any model on series 2 sportage without a DPF?

[The Don]

By the looks of it replacement of the oil separator is expensive for X trail.

Any idea about the Sportage Series 2? any model on series 2 sportage without a DPF?

There was a version imported to SL I believe. But in most countries you cannot conform to emissions standards without the DPF. My diesel has done 116,000 miles and no issues so far with the DPF. Its needed a new turbo and a new oil separator in that time though.

I don't think you should worry about it too much.

[john cooper]

Looks to me the 2006 Sportage is fitted with DPF and 2005, 2008, 2009 is not (found on another forum) what is the best way to test this?

regards

JC

[Magnum]

My Hiace has DPF and you do not have to worry much about it as you mentioned that the vehicle you are going to buy will go through a highway on regular basis. bdw on some Hiace and Vanette vans i have seen a button to clean the DPF manually. Anyway in case if it gets clogged you can taking to the dealer and get it cleaned.

I remember reading somewhere that having a DPF unit helps the turbo to work better reducing lag

[The Don]

My Hiace has DPF and you do not have to worry much about it as you mentioned that the vehicle you are going to buy will go through a highway on regular basis. bdw on some Hiace and Vanette vans i have seen a button to clean the DPF manually. Anyway in case if it gets clogged you can taking to the dealer and get it cleaned.

I remember reading somewhere that having a DPF unit helps the turbo to work better reducing lag

Not sure about Sri Lanka, but dealers won't clean blocked DPFs. They will simply replce which in Europe is a pretty expensive job.

[Kavvz]

Not sure about Sri Lanka, but dealers won't clean blocked DPFs. They will simply replce which in Europe is a pretty expensive job.

Yet another reason NOT to go to the dealer and instead to patronize a good mechanic with a couple of chairs-under-the-mango-tree type setup and a good tea shop close by...

[Magnum]

Yet another reason NOT to go to the dealer and instead to patronize a good mechanic with a couple of chairs-under-the-mango-tree type setup and a good tea shop close by...

Do mechanics outside the dealer know to clean to the DPF unit? i thought most of them just remove it

[Kavvz]

Do mechanics outside the dealer know to clean to the DPF unit? i thought most of them just remove it

Of course not. You'll have to download the service manual / technical bulletin yourself and figure it out or take it along to some specialist under-the-mango-tree-guy who actually knows how to do it !!

( I was joking above, for something like the DPF unit, I'd probably go to the dealer too. But I'd first look for the technical bulletin online and see if its something I could talk my local guy through, if its complicated or something that would potentially mess the sensors up, and make a right royal mess if not done right, I'd high-tail it to the agent )

[Magnum]

I contacted Toyota Lanka they said its possible to clean the DPF system, i inquired for the Hiace.

[john cooper]

"Possible" is not a 100% its gone work, as its possible to clean but no guarantee how long gone last???????????????? so better stay away from the Lemon

X Trail story is at the end now and looking for a Sportage or a Petrol RAV4 XA31

regards

JC

[The Don]

The thing is DPFs are here to stay.

Just like a lot of things, over time we will find better solutions. But for the moment its best to be aware of that when we buy vehicles. Diesels don't deliver great savings if they are used for DPF block type driving anyway (short bursts at slow speeds).

But we don't need to fear them, and like automatic transmissions people will find better ways of resolving issues associated with them.

To be honest I don't understand the generation anyway. It seems like whatever enviomental benefit they had is lost when they are regenerated. Almost better to have a removable and disposable filter that can be replaced cheaply like all other filters.

Note even on BMWs people have cleaned DPFs and had good results. It was obviously done out of the dealership and an electronic reset required afterwards.

Edited April 27, 2015 by The Don

[Devinda_Z]

JC, this may be a far left option but if it's a safe small SUV you're after, why not a Subaru ?

There seem to be a lot of brand enthusiasts down in NZ and have found some model specific forums quite useful.

I have no idea what prices are like there but since you are now considering a petrol RAV4 as an option i doubt a new(er) Forester is going to be that much dearer in terms of the fuel economy, if thats a key concern.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/subaru/auction-877781580.htm

[iRage]

"Possible" is not a 100% its gone work, as its possible to clean but no guarantee how long gone last???????????????? so better stay away from the Lemon

X Trail story is at the end now and looking for a Sportage or a Petrol RAV4 XA31

You mean ACA31...I believe in NZ (I guess in AUS as well as a grey import) you get the JDM ACA31 with the 2.4L VVTi + CVT combo as well as the AUS spec RAV4s with the long wheel base (Vanguard) body, these things came by the ship load to Timor. The latter comes as ACA33R (AWD) or ACA38R (2WD) with a 2.4L engine or as GSA33 with a 3.5L engine .The hitch is these AUS spec RAV4s came with a 5 speed (or 6 speed) standard A/T.The A/T with the 3.5L engine was fine and moved like a bat out of hell thanks to the engine but the 2.4L with the A/T box was appalling (granted wouldn't make much of a differenceifyou plan to stick to city driving and no heavy trailers, etc...). It made the car slow, which was slow to begin with because the 2.4L engine was barely sufficient for the lager body; and the gear changes were twitchy. So if you do go for an AUS spec ACA33R may I suggest a M/T variant ?

[john cooper]

JC, this may be a far left option but if it's a safe small SUV you're after, why not a Subaru ?

There seem to be a lot of brand enthusiasts down in NZ and have found some model specific forums quite useful.

I have no idea what prices are like there but since you are now considering a petrol RAV4 as an option i doubt a new(er) Forester is going to be that much dearer in terms of the fuel economy, if thats a key concern.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/used-cars/subaru/auction-877781580.htm

Forester is much capable SUV then the rest in its class but i have to think of the maintenance too as its bit expensive to maintain, (Work shops in here charge extra $$ for Subaru) so better stick with something like Toyota

[john cooper]

You mean ACA31...I believe in NZ (I guess in AUS as well as a grey import) you get the JDM ACA31 with the 2.4L VVTi + CVT combo as well as the AUS spec RAV4s with the long wheel base (Vanguard) body, these things came by the ship load to Timor. The latter comes as ACA33R (AWD) or ACA38R (2WD) with a 2.4L engine or as GSA33 with a 3.5L engine .The hitch is these AUS spec RAV4s came with a 5 speed (or 6 speed) standard A/T.The A/T with the 3.5L engine was fine and moved like a bat out of hell thanks to the engine but the 2.4L with the A/T box was appalling (granted wouldn't make much of a differenceifyou plan to stick to city driving and no heavy trailers, etc...). It made the car slow, which was slow to begin with because the 2.4L engine was barely sufficient for the lager body; and the gear changes were twitchy. So if you do go for an AUS spec ACA33R may I suggest a M/T variant ?

I have checked few jap import Rav4'S weekend and going to finalize and nego the price with the dealer and will see how this go, not going for a NZ New model as wife can't drive manual but auto version also available but not at our price range, wife is bit fuzz about the traction control so we can only go with selected G Grade models with DAC equipped

regards

JC

[john cooper]

Update guys,

Thank you for all the opinion and help

Spend the Sunday from morning to afternoon to check the vehicle and finally wife pick the one that she want

Been to so may dealers and you know ladies so picky. i was sick and tired at the end and been to a dealer who stock 1000+ cars and ask her to go and select anything for the budget, after she pass all Outlanders, Dualis, X-TRAIL, CR-V and STOP next to her favorite RAV4 G spec

So we finally got all the spec wife wants (Reverse cam, DAC + Traction control, cruise control)

P.S in the hunt of finding a one for my in law in SL under 8 mil

regards

JC

[Kavvz]

Update guys,

Thank you for all the opinion and help

Spend the Sunday from morning to afternoon to check the vehicle and finally wife pick the one that she want

Been to so may dealers and you know ladies so picky. i was sick and tired at the end and been to a dealer who stock 1000+ cars and ask her to go and select anything for the budget, after she pass all Outlanders, Dualis, X-TRAIL, CR-V and STOP next to her favorite RAV4 G spec

So we finally got all the spec wife wants (Reverse cam, DAC + Traction control, cruise control)

P.S in the hunt of finding a one for my in law in SL under 8 mil

regards

JC

Your wife passed up a Honda CRV no kidding? I thought that'd be the one women gravitate to out of the lot...Pretty nice interior too. I'm totally surprised!!

[john cooper]

Your wife passed up a Honda CRV no kidding? I thought that'd be the one women gravitate to out of the lot...Pretty nice interior too. I'm totally surprised!!

She like the spare wheel on the back door design and CR-V's in that place not with back wheel so that is a reason to skip the CR-V + the gear stick on 2005 model

regards

JC

[Kavvz]

She like the spare wheel on the back door design and CR-V's in that place not with back wheel so that is a reason to skip the CR-V + the gear stick on 2005 model

regards

JC

Having the spare wheel on the back actually makes it harder to open and close the rear boot door; but I guess it didn't matter too much in this case. (I think on the new RAV4 they've stuck the rear wheel underneath like on the CRV too). What was the issue with the gear stick? Was it in a weird location?

Edited May 5, 2015 by Kavvz

[john cooper]

Having the spare wheel on the back actually makes it harder to open and close the rear boot door; but I guess it didn't matter too much in this case. (I think on the new RAV4 they've stuck the rear wheel underneath like on the CRV too). What was the issue with the gear stick? Was it in a weird location?

Toyota Vanguard is not under our price tag but any way its not in wifu's spec list, Yes the gear stick from dash she don't like and me too

[iRage]

The Vanguard (which is JDM only) is pretty much the Aus spec Rav4 a30 series with a CVT for the 2.4L engine. Even the Vanguard had the door mounted spare wheel as an option which cost like 100k yen or something, so u see a few around. I think what Kavvz meantwas the 40 series,the latest comes with the sparewheel inside