Range is not updated after fuel refill - Toyota Aqua 2015

[mgtdan n9i8u]

Hi Friends,

Recently I noticed in my Aqua, after refilling the fuel driving Range is not updated in the dashboard (Range means length which you can drive from the available fuel). What would be reason for this?

I normally switch off the car when refilling the fuel and fuel meter is showing the fuel availability correctly.

Thanks

[Davy]

I'm pretty sure the Prius manual says that adding a small quantity of fuel will not update the range. Not sure what "small quantity" means here, but I assume you need to add at least quarter of a tank for the system to update. 

So try putting in a full tank of fuel and that should update the range. 

As for shutting off the engine while refuelling, this is the right practice. 

[terrabytetango]

Did you try resetting the trip meter?

[ajm]

is the km/l value similar to before?

[mgtdan n9i8u]

  On 8/6/2018 at 5:08 AM, terrabytetango said:

Did you try resetting the trip meter?

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Yes, It will work. But it happens again. Any known route cause for this issue?

[mgtdan n9i8u]

  On 8/6/2018 at 6:06 AM, ajm said:

is the km/l value similar to before?

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Yes, Km/l is normal.

[gayanath]

Don't worry. This is normal for Aqua. This may happens time to time (mainly when you refill partially). It will sometimes reset next day or next full tank. 

Don't know whether this has any technical reason, but highly unlikely because fuel gauge is working properly. 

Edited August 6, 2018 by gayanath

[vag2]

  On 8/6/2018 at 1:08 PM, gayanath said:

 This is normal for Aqua.

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This may be normal for Gayanaths' Aqua, but not for any car in general. ?

The range is considered to be a safety critical information these days, just like vehicle speed. If a driver thinks he has enough range while driving in the highway when the real range is less, this could lead to Engine Stall at high speeds and end in a deadly accident. But as long as the driver also considers the Fuel gauge and the real range is more than the shown range, it should be safe. In any case I would get a scan  done, since it will reveal if there is a major problem.

[gayanath]

  On 8/6/2018 at 1:52 PM, vag2 said:

This may be normal for Gayanaths' Aqua, but not for any car in general. ?

The range is considered to be a safety critical information these days, just like vehicle speed. If a driver thinks he has enough range while driving in the highway when the real range is less, this could lead to Engine Stall at high speeds and end in a deadly accident. But as long as the driver also considers the Fuel gauge and the real range is more than the shown range, it should be safe. In any case I would get a scan  done, since it will reveal if there is a major problem.

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Have you experienced Aqua?

මාලුව නහින්නෙ කට නිසාලු ....

[vag2]

https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/hal-00848610/PDF/9_Westman_J_-_A_Reference_Example_on_the_Specification_of_Safety_Requirements_using_ISO_26262.pdf

 

ever heard if ISO-26262 and ASIL classifications on automotive design?

if Toyota hears your judgment "it's normal to show inaccurate range" in a Toyota designed vehicle, they will get a heart attack and go for an immediate recall! Just curious where you have studied about automotive software functions and electronics ?

[Sadik]

Same scenario in all the cars i've used including the Allion & X-Trail. Unless you top up the tank , the range doesn't get updated.

For some strange reason the Montero seems to update even for small volumes such as 10 litres, ( which i do during last date of the month , due to fuel quota reset). But no idea on the technicals 

[gayanath]

  On 8/6/2018 at 8:00 PM, vag2 said:

https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/hal-00848610/PDF/9_Westman_J_-_A_Reference_Example_on_the_Specification_of_Safety_Requirements_using_ISO_26262.pdf

 

ever heard if ISO-26262 and ASIL classifications on automotive design?

if Toyota hears your judgment "it's normal to show inaccurate range" in a Toyota designed vehicle, they will get a heart attack and go for an immediate recall! Just curious where you have studied about automotive software functions and electronics ?

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You have nothing to do with this research paper and this is regarding the gauge. But the OP's matter is Range not the gauge.

Gauge is critical but range is additional indicative feature for vehicles (though its becoming a stranded feature now). Actually, I too have a question why range not updates while gauge is working properly (It should be just a calculation). But that's how it is. 

Since X-trails also having same issue,  Shall we write this to All Japanese car makers..... After all get heart attacks, Prof. @vag2 could be head of Toyota and Nissan. 

[raveeJaya]

Hi,

There is setting for the user (in my premio )to show whether to Reset the millage automatically after the fill up or reset it manually. Just check whether you have change the settings.

[Davy]

  On 8/8/2018 at 6:38 AM, gayanath said:

Actually, I too have a question why range not updates while gauge is working properly (It should be just a calculation). But that's how it is. 

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Although it's a simple calculation, the necessary hardware needs to be available in the car to carry it out. The fuel tank's float or level sensor needs to take into account even minor changes (increases) in the fuel level after a partial fill-up. But I don't believe they're designed this way on the vehicles in question which are regular inexpensive road cars. Instead, the float/sensor can only detect when the fuel level has a substantial change.

To add to this, modern cars with digital fuel gauges use variable resistors and a small bit of circuitry to calculate the level of fuel. This also takes into account some dampening to avoid moving the gauge all over the place when the car goes around a corner or over bumps and causing the fuel to slosh inside the fuel tank. So it's possible a partial fill up just falls within the threshold of the dampening as well. Only a fill-up that exceeds the threshold would be considered a fill-up.

None of these issues exist in fully electric cars, thus being able to provide a far more accurate range.

[vag2]

  On 8/8/2018 at 6:38 AM, gayanath said:

 

Gauge is critical but range is additional indicative feature for vehicles (though its becoming a stranded feature now). Actually, I too have a question why range not updates while gauge is working properly (It should be just a calculation). But that's how it is. 

 

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wrong again. You just proved you have no idea about Automotive Design and safety principles or software. In this paper, the [Fuel level] is calculated using the variables [sensed fuel level] and [fuel rate L/h] Since the[fuel level] is safety-critical, it makes all the variables also safety-critical. Calculation of [Range] is using [Fuel level], [fuel rate L/h] and the [speed km/h]. Its not " just a calculation" like a maka bass may think. It is also safety -critical because

1.many drivers nowadays are using [Range] instead of [fuel level ], as the [range] is exactly what he needs to know when driving on low fuel level it's also safety-critical

2. When the [fuel level] and [Range] show conflicting information, it can confuse the driver. In a developed country this is enough to take the vehicle manufacturer to Court when the driver is fined for entering the highway without enough fuel and causing an accident.

I suggest you stick to topics you know such as welding and metal bending and leave software and electronics to other people.

 

By the way electric cars are also not perfect, because the State of Charge calculation and the Charge monitoring systems also are known to contain errors.

Edited August 8, 2018 by vag2

[gayanath]

  On 8/8/2018 at 8:08 AM, vag2 said:

wrong again. You just proved you have no idea about Automotive Design and safety principles or software. In this paper, the [Fuel level] is calculated using the variables [sensed fuel level] and [fuel rate L/h] Since the[fuel level] is safety-critical, it makes all the variables also safety-critical. Calculation of [Range] is using [Fuel level], [fuel rate L/h] and the [speed km/h]. Its not " just a calculation" like a maka bass may think. It is also safety -critical because

1.many drivers nowadays are using [Range] instead of [fuel level ], as the [range] is exactly what he needs to know when driving on low fuel level it's also safety-critical

2. When the [fuel level] and [Range] show conflicting information, it can confuse the driver. In a developed country this is enough to take the vehicle manufacturer to Court when the driver is fined for entering the highway without enough fuel and causing an accident.

I suggest you stick to topics you know such as welding and metal bending and leave software and electronics to other people.

By the way electric cars are also not perfect, because the State of Charge calculation and the Charge monitoring systems also are known to contain errors.

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What a ........... you are? ??

After all your theories of Automotive design, safety and software, still we are at same point. 

I have an Aqua.  I experienced the range issue occasionally while refueling such as OP. While gauge perfectly updating (which means floater - hardware - working well) range shows same value just before refuel. But car runs perfectly every time without an issue. @Sadik has experienced same in Allions and X-trails. 

So, what is your suggestion to OP rather than thousands of talks? Ask OP to send the car to Toyota to investigate this safety critical issue and then Toyota may recall all Aquas (+ Allions and Nissan for X-trails)?

You better select politics in Sri Lanka ........ ??

 

[vag2]

  On 8/8/2018 at 8:43 AM, gayanath said:

 

 

You better select politics in Sri Lanka ........ ??

 

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No thanks, you are more suitable to the job as proven by your negligence towards Technical and safety principles and the ability to talk like an expert on any topic you have no idea about?

As someone even giving opinions on TV,  people expect more from you from an Engineering point of view.  Not just "The problem is OK because in other cases it is also happening"

Otherwise you will end up like the joker Mr.Potato-estate ?

[Davy]

@gayanath, @vag2

Now now guys, some maturity please. You don't need to insult or name-call to debate about something.

[Sadik]

  On 8/8/2018 at 9:49 AM, Davy said:

@gayanath, @vag2

Now now guys, some maturity please. You don't need to insult or name-call to debate about something.

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Yes Gentlemen, I agree with Davy- All of us are a set of people who have the same interests in mind which is the undying love for these road going metal beasts   , a passion only a very limited no of people share.... So we shouldn't have conflict among ourselves. Lets try to reach a well informed decision via doing more research on the subject.

Peace...

 

[Crosswind]

  On 8/8/2018 at 9:49 AM, Davy said:

@gayanath, @vag2

Now now guys, some maturity please. You don't need to insult or name-call to debate about something.

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Spoilsport!

For a change, I'm enjoying someone else having an argument with @gayanath 

[gayanath]

  On 8/8/2018 at 9:49 AM, Davy said:

@gayanath, @vag2

Now now guys, some maturity please. You don't need to insult or name-call to debate about something.

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@Davy, Its cool....... Just having fun while learning...... 

I'm so sorry if others have any inconvenience please.

 

Edited August 9, 2018 by gayanath

[Davy]

  On 8/9/2018 at 6:21 AM, Crosswind said:

Spoilsport!

For a change, I'm enjoying someone else having an argument with @gayanath 

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lol I'll remember that for next time. 

[MV-5]

how is this calculation done, is it based on the last minute fuel consumption,last five 10 minutes, or last hour fuel consumption or long term average fuel consumption?

[ajm]

in my PUG, the range changes depending on if I am driving uphill or downhill for a few minutes on Highway even at same speed. That means it should be using the average fuel consumption rate and the Distance travelled during that time, updated every few minutes.