Cornering body roll, rear passenger comfort & space

[everyf4]

This is a rant + seeking advice so bare with me also I have read most of the threads on comparing these cars but still I have specific doubts 

My use case -
1 Weekend drive  kandy to nuwara eliya (Every week)
2 Driving within gampola/nawala pitiya suburbia  !  

I really like what I have now its an AWD DA64 Every wagon, its small, compact, Lot of space K van with 64hp thats more than enough for me. Also I really like the AWD its entry level but helped me lot of times (every RWD vans have this issue of rear wheel spin)

The bummer is body roll its unbearable ! People are telling me to go for big tires wider (boku) alloy wheels, nope I want things to be stock (will change alloy wheels of correct size but not wider ones ) 
Now mine does 8kmpl city with 4 passengers and long drive 9-10kmpl thats okayish for me

My budget is around 3.5 - 4.5 Million but I am looking for practicality (A to B, dicky space, less body roll, basic options,  compact vehicle)
 

My choices 

1. I love the new swift but it lacks ground clearance 120mm is not enough ?
2. New vitz hmmm all of you guys were complaining about it comparing it for a CR42 so meh.. (145 mm is enough but what about rear passenger seats and dicky space )
3. New Passo same engine but if I get a boon I can save a lot, BANG for BUCK ! (concern is body roll ?)
4. Tank/Roomy spacious vehicle (again concern is body roll ?)

Also vitz 2010-2012 1.3 or RS versions its an old car but I like the RS version I have no issue with having more hp, its just compact ones are most of the time lacks hp 

UPDATE - I dont like turbos Im going NA

Guys please advice 

 

read most of these threads 
http://autolanka.com/forums/topic/21383-what-is-an-suspension-upgrade-for-a-vitz-and-howwhere-to-get-it-done/
http://autolanka.com/forums/topic/21477-vitz-or-wagon-r-turbo/
http://autolanka.com/forums/topic/21509-buying-a-new-vitz/
http://autolanka.com/forums/topic/21088-vitz-safety-editions/

Edited May 21, 2020 by everyf4

[hrm]

If it helps I had a Vitz 1.3 2007 for 4 years and regularly did Colombo to Nawalapitiya  through Ginigathhena which included narrow and rough estate roads at my relations village. Ground clearance is bit low at 145mm but still it always got where i want it to be without a sweat. 

[everyf4]

1 hour ago, iRage said:

You should really really really change your perception about this. All garages, including a monkey with a wrenchm would say they know the Vitz because it is a simple 4cyl engine...which is exactly the problem with these cars.

People think that it is simple and take it to maka baases who completely and utterly screw up the car with sub standard parts and random works around. These people treat modern engines the same way they treated E80 Corolla engines from the 80s because it is Toyota and because it is 4 cylinder. Yes..it is a simple 4 pot engine..but there really is nothing simple about new 4 pots....newer engines, in the interest of emissions and fuel efficiency, have all kinds of gizmos attached to it. Even the engine materials used are much more advanced compounds than in the 80s (for heat absorption and dissipation). Even the simple act of not using a torque wrench to tighten a valve cover could cause the thing to warp. So...even for a Vitz..you need to take it to a proper garage. They are not cheap (as the maka baases would be)...and for them there really is not much difference between a Vitz and a Forester. Having said that...I doubt owning a Subaru in or around Kandy is as difficult as you claim it to be. There are quite a few Subaru owners in Kandy I know of.

As you go about looking for a car you will see what I mean....you will find a lot of crap out there that is "agent maintained" but you see that apart from a periodic service, repairs and other matters have been handled by monkeys with wrenches. 

On the other hand...did we talk about the possibility of a Lancer ? These are export model variants with decent amount of ground clearance and for the most part they have been taken care of. 

Again and again I agree with most of the points and I do not doubt what you guys say about the problems with makabass, vehicles performance specially the subaru ! Im sorry but my anxiety kicks in (lot of WHAT IF's)

I 100% understand the risk of getting into a bad trade and ending up with a metal crap and how the overlooked vehicles are ages better and maintained well than the typical toyotas, yet its is harder for me to get out of the typical "Toyota" mindset (exception swift )

Its not in the top of the list ! first step drive one and look for hatchbacks  
so found 4-5 2nd gen 1.3 vitz and I understand the risk of selecting a toyota but I have my goals set ! 

May be next vehicle I can move to a sedan or an SUV but at this point I will try to find a hatchback 

Thank you guys !
I’ve learned a lot about cars,  I really appreciate the inputs, opinions and advice ! 

PS - BTW I drove a Nissan TIDA for an year in the dubai back in 2012 also test drove a maxima (7th gen), loved those cars ! 

Edited May 29, 2020 by everyf4

[iRage]

11 minutes ago, everyf4 said:

Again and again I agree with most of the points and I do not doubt what you guys say about the problems with makabass, vehicles performance specially the subaru ! Im sorry but my anxiety kicks in (lot of WHAT IF's)

 

The point is....your what ifs should be on double overload with the average Toyotas. Anyone who knows me knows that I am a Toyota-fan...95% of the cars I have owned have been Toyotas. Even I would tell you...don't let the "Toyota" mind set blind you from the reality. There is a lot of junk out there. There literally are no good main stream Toyotas out there that have been properly taken care of. Seems like you are looking in to a Toyota for the security of the maka baas network

Also...even though the 1.3L Vitz is far better than the 1L variant..it still is a very detached car. You should do some suspension mods for it to actually handle better.

[kush]

22 hours ago, iRage said:

The point is....your what ifs should be on double overload with the average Toyotas. Anyone who knows me knows that I am a Toyota-fan...95% of the cars I have owned have been Toyotas. Even I would tell you...don't let the "Toyota" mind set blind you from the reality. There is a lot of junk out there. There literally are no good main stream Toyotas out there that have been properly taken care of. Seems like you are looking in to a Toyota for the security of the maka baas network

Also...even though the 1.3L Vitz is far better than the 1L variant..it still is a very detached car. You should do some suspension mods for it to actually handle better.

Not totally agree, we have quite a few Allions/ Premios used by our staff (personal vehicles) imported new maintained with lot of TLC.

Most of transfer hands though personally without even advertising.

[AVANTE]

On 5/28/2020 at 10:55 PM, Devinda_Z said:

@everyf4 your initial qualms are somewhat valid but i do need to set the record straight about some of the comments above.

 

I do concede that a Forester might not work for your application if you need to be conservative in your choice when focusing purely on re-sale.

However it is a glaring error to claim that Sri Lanka doesn't have proper agent - what would possess you to make such a claim??

 

Senok (Grandpass) have held the agency for Subaru for nearly 30 years in Sri Lanka!

They have, in my personal opinion one of the best after sales and service divisions amongst the plethora of car companies represented in Sri Lanka. 

Sure they don't have a network of islandwide workshops like Toyota Lanka or a fancy workshop like D*MO 800 has for Mercedes/Jeep but they have an excellent team who actually take time effort and pride in their work.

At the risk of sounding like a commercial for Senok's Subaru division I should point out that the workshop itself in Grandpass was upgraded last year. 

I've owned 4 Subaru's and have dealt with them for over a decade so i'm not talking based on a one off experience.

 

Aside from the agent Senok, there a number of others who provide technical expertise when dealing with boxer flat fours which got @Kavvz excited. Nilanka in Kottawa has been fixing, servicing, converting & even tuning race cars for years.

Then there are others like Platinum Auto Spa led by Sabry Abdul Salam who handle their share of Subaru performance cars from the racing circles as well.

 

On the subject of parts, again this is a market misconception. Please don't think this is being directed at you @everyf4 - i mean no offense. I only wish to clear the air on this subject.

 

The agents themselves carry parts for the newer models and for the variants they imported brand new (which is the same as all other agents)

In addition common service parts are a non issue.

90's-2000's Subaru's (like some other Japanese cars as well) also occasionally shared parts with other Japanese manufacturers so there are occasionally bits like brake components, sensors etc that match more commons Nissans etc.

 

Personally I have opted to get down things I need from the following sites : 

www.rockauto.com

www.rhdjapan.com 

www.partsouq.com

 

They all deliver here with little to no drama.

 

If you want used parts, then off the top of my head the following usually carry stock - 

Body parts, lights, etc: Izumi, Taiyo, PowerAutoLamps/Mirai in Delkanda

Mechanical parts / performance parts : Pleasure Racing Nawinna

Service parts : Supreme Motorhouse Highlevel Road

Full conversion kits/ performance parts : Top Level Performance Kotte, Jayasinghe Enterprises Belanwila

 

In addition there are a number of smaller vendors who hand carry parts and maintain stock who can be found on Facebook etc.

 

There are 2 main owners clubs that are very active (Flat4orce/Subaru Owners Club Sri Lanka) & the Forester Owners Club

The clubs offer support by way of advice, support with sourcing and in the case of the Forester club which I know even have annual events which have even included  trips, off road track days, meet ups etc.

 

So i'm sure by now @everyf4 it is clear that Subaru in Sri Lanka has far more support than you give it credit for. I will admit that I can't offer you first hand advice about repair assistance up in the hill country but perhaps someone like @AVANTE may have insights. I know there a few owners up in the hill country and one party who does Forester conversions and upgrades up there as well (Ruwan).

 

Most who have owned a Subaru, especially a turbo Subaru rarely stray from the brand (at least not for long!) and many of us have or have had, multiple models over the years.

I can go on and on, but I won't

 

I'm not suggesting you get one because as @iRage rightly said, they aren't easy to sell in that it doesn't have the mainstream appeal that other cars have simply because they were a special proposition and not many were willing to live with the high fuel consumption of the turbo+All wheel drive combination, but those in the know come looking for them and will even pay a premium to get their hands on these kinds of cars that have often been cared for by owners who are more enthusiasts rather than people buying travel appliances.

I really like your enthusiasm here. 

Unfortunately, I have no idea about Senok around these parts but there used to be a 2nd Gen forester and an STI4 RA roaming the town. The STI4 had a major oil leak problem and the owner spent a week or two getting it fixed at a local garage where he also used to do basic maintenance.  

Also, not to mention the countless subies roaming the nuwara side. @everyf4 they are not as nightmarish as you think they might be to own in these parts of the county as @Devinda_Z has explained. Parts are attainable and repairs can be done, albeit not as easily and readily as a Toyota. You should reserve those nightmares for uncommon euro cars like Alfas, Citroens and Volvos.

Just make sure to find a trustworthy mechanic and you're all set. 

Overall it depends on what kind of life you want to live. I know I wouldn't want to be stuck behind a juki machine econobox forever. The subies (in the lankan context) are between Japanese reliability/attainability and serious performance, a touch of both. 

Also @Devinda_Z, what are you opinions on Supreme nugegoda and Spec-J Tuning when it comes to delivering and pricing performance parts? 

[Devinda_Z]

3 hours ago, AVANTE said:

Also @Devinda_Z, what are you opinions on Supreme nugegoda and Spec-J Tuning when it comes to delivering and pricing performance parts? 

Supreme mostly has norml parts (new), filters and other consumables. They generally carry decent products, inventory for Subaru's and reputed brands. The family that owns Supreme is directly connected to Pleasure Racing Services. They have a good selection of parts for JDM performance cars in stock usually. 

I bought a used genuine branded/original item from Spec-J and had it couriered to me with no issues about 3-4 years ago. The part worked well ?

 

 

In general, I am rather sceptical of vendors selling anything which looks like something that could have been sourced from Malaysia or China (despite the fancy boxes with barcodes!)

As an example on hoses, I once got a quotation from Time Motorsports in the UK. They are an authorised reseller of SAMCO genuine products and I was directed to them by SAMCO themselves. The cost of a full kit of silicone hoses was GBP 680 approximately, excluding shipping! This begs a question as to how so many locally seem to be able to offer similar "Samco"silicone hoses for under LKR 20k with images which look suspiciously similar to those on AliExpress ads....?

There are plenty who have suffered catastrophic component failure running these "duppa"or "replica" parts simply because they're either too naive to know or too cheap to splurge on the real deal.

[AVANTE]

6 hours ago, Devinda_Z said:

In general, I am rather sceptical of vendors selling anything which looks like something that could have been sourced from Malaysia or China (despite the fancy boxes with barcodes!)

As an example on hoses, I once got a quotation from Time Motorsports in the UK. They are an authorised reseller of SAMCO genuine products and I was directed to them by SAMCO themselves. The cost of a full kit of silicone hoses was GBP 680 approximately, excluding shipping! This begs a question as to how so many locally seem to be able to offer similar "Samco"silicone hoses for under LKR 20k with images which look suspiciously similar to those on AliExpress ads....?

There are plenty who have suffered catastrophic component failure running these "duppa"or "replica" parts simply because they're either too naive to know or too cheap to splurge on the real deal.

GBP 680? Eesh, was this for an impreza? I thought they'd be cheaper since it's a common upgrade for subie owners. 

Also, not just parts. I'm even skeptical about buying oil these days. There are counterfeits too! 

 

Edited May 31, 2020 by AVANTE

[iRage]

On 5/30/2020 at 11:35 AM, kush said:

Not totally agree, we have quite a few Allions/ Premios used by our staff (personal vehicles) imported new maintained with lot of TLC.

Most of transfer hands though personally without even advertising.

Which is sort of what I meant...there are no common good Allions/Premios/Axios that are good for sale and they are not taken care of. They all have to be treated with distrustful eyes as they are all crap. Only a very very very small percentage of common Toyotas have been taken care of and they rarely come up for sale. Even those..after the second owner most of them fall in to the s**** status as the others. So in SL...the idea of a well maintained good common Toyota is a bit of a mythical creature. Kind of like the big foot  

Edited May 31, 2020 by iRage

[AVANTE]

1 hour ago, iRage said:

mythical creature. Kind of like the big foot  

Mohini: Am I a joke to you? 

[Devinda_Z]

4 hours ago, AVANTE said:

GBP 680? Eesh, was this for an impreza? I thought they'd be cheaper since it's a common upgrade for subie owners. 

Also, not just parts. I'm even skeptical about buying oil these days. There are counterfeits too! 

 

It is but the construction of most of those in circulation leaves much to be desired! I have a bad feeling most go with the shiny ones because they're colourful & cheap ?‍♂️

Various issues ranging from unwanted flex, rips, leaks

Oil is another mess....so many issues, import licensing drama....?‍♂️

[john cooper]

I can see lots of discussion about Forester, I have picked up my very 1st Subaru and it's a 2015 Forester XT Premium, done high km.

I had many many cars over the years and never had something like this, i mean it handles like go cart and very nippy.

Can i convince someone to buy a Subi ??

 

everyf4 unsure how many original Vitz RS's in SL (My auntie got a one) i had a one and sold it not long ago, stiffer suspension, 1NZ FE 1500cc engine, not the best with the CVT but can't complain, less body roll and good steering respond but bad turning circle.

regards,

JC

[Kavvz]

17 minutes ago, john cooper said:

I can see lots of discussion about Forester, I have picked up my very 1st Subaru and it's a 2015 Forester XT Premium

 

Wow! What great news! Happy for you buddy! 

I shall be looking forward to reading more about it on the forum! ?

 

Edited July 6, 2020 by Kavvz

[K.o.N.o.S]

2 hours ago, john cooper said:

I can see lots of discussion about Forester, I have picked up my very 1st Subaru and it's a 2015 Forester XT Premium, done high km.

I had many many cars over the years and never had something like this, i mean it handles like go cart and very nippy.

Can i convince someone to buy a Subi ??

 

everyf4 unsure how many original Vitz RS's in SL (My auntie got a one) i had a one and sold it not long ago, stiffer suspension, 1NZ FE 1500cc engine, not the best with the CVT but can't complain, less body roll and good steering respond but bad turning circle.

regards,

JC

Congratulations on your 1st Subi. This deserves a separate thread with lots of pics. Looking forward to read more on your experience.